From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Richard Stallman Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.tangents Subject: Re: Is ChatGTP SaaSS? (was: [NonGNU ELPA] New package: llm) Date: Fri, 08 Sep 2023 20:38:45 -0400 Message-ID: References: <87v8d0iqa5.fsf@posteo.net> <87cyz3vaws.fsf@localhost> <87a5tzsbvl.fsf@localhost> Reply-To: rms@gnu.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="3319"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: emacs-tangents@gnu.org, jporterbugs@gmail.com, ahyatt@gmail.com To: Ihor Radchenko Original-X-From: emacs-tangents-bounces+get-emacs-tangents=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Sep 09 02:39:17 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: get-emacs-tangents@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1qem0H-0000Uf-Gs for get-emacs-tangents@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 09 Sep 2023 02:39:13 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qelzv-0000kM-L4; Fri, 08 Sep 2023 20:38:52 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qelzq-0000k4-JV for emacs-tangents@gnu.org; Fri, 08 Sep 2023 20:38:46 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qelzp-0006PZ-Vx; Fri, 08 Sep 2023 20:38:46 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=Date:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: mime-version; bh=0JM5qMphlpuwUE/w4UMxzuiEEFmlge93AGeXFhD6BXo=; b=AwM9d/Pq1WpL OMUZA/hXcSLpSd9ef9/wOmoGkmhXospbcffvzvCRaZJiFT/K71sUGb4F/3UhwpRFCgZe93ws64KJe 5dGVJ8jPlmXcifo2BVNyu3yn5eTDKy/YO9MYuRd0M6+kdm8HIl98USuHRR+iz609mczSVS6KG1N6k Gy6YoUl+GuK3CYXfEDWzh3qdDyK0zGkOjZzzokP7IUZVH1bsUEYtJsmGFppw6n+4RtP6D1fIehCT5 3sNTthDCeiRhYTR7+veH6bGhzpGgP1uR5W98Zxy0AUFkFU/Rb4ylqEImhoBMYs3LDSxrVdghJLg2F MayBHBs8uG371pT9DgjwLA==; Original-Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qelzp-0003lR-Nq; Fri, 08 Sep 2023 20:38:45 -0400 In-Reply-To: <87a5tzsbvl.fsf@localhost> (message from Ihor Radchenko on Wed, 06 Sep 2023 12:51:42 +0000) X-BeenThere: emacs-tangents@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Emacs news and miscellaneous discussions outside the scope of other Emacs mailing lists List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-tangents-bounces+get-emacs-tangents=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-tangents-bounces+get-emacs-tangents=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.tangents:1058 Archived-At: [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > ... what is constant is that the company can use > our conversations with ChatGPT to train the model. This is not a > surprise or a secret, the company has always reported it. > There is no doubt that ChatGTP itself is not libre - its model is not > available to public. However, users of the ChatGPT model are technically > providing input that is collaboratively editing that model weights > (training the model further). So, using ChatGTP is a little bit akin > editing Wikipedia pages - collaborating to improve ChatGTP. That is a valid point, at the practical level. But the differences are crucial. 1. In Wikipedia, a contributor voluntarily chooses to participate in editing, Editing participation is separate from consulting the encyclopedia. This fits the word "collaborating. By contrast, a when the develoers of ChatGTP make it learn from the user, that "contribution" is neither voluntary nor active. It is more "being taken advantage of" than "collaborating". 2. Wikipedia is a community project to develop a free/libre work. (It is no coincidence that this resembles the GNU Project.) Morally it deserves community support, despite some things it handles badly. By contrast, ChatGTP is neither a community project nor free/libre. That's perhaps why it arranges to manipulate people into "contributing" rather than letting them choose. -- Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org) Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org)