From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Andrea Corallo Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Suppressing native compilation (short and long term) Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2022 16:04:46 +0000 Message-ID: References: <87bkqxf1ij.fsf@tethera.net> <871qrrpkgx.fsf@trouble.defaultvalue.org> <834jwnbi6c.fsf@gnu.org> <87mtafnun5.fsf@trouble.defaultvalue.org> <83sfk6ahty.fsf@gnu.org> <8735c6b0wo.fsf@gnus.org> <87y1ty9lha.fsf@gnus.org> <87lepym6ok.fsf@trouble.defaultvalue.org> <877d1i9h7k.fsf@gnus.org> <83edvqyr3q.fsf@gnu.org> <874jwl8e4p.fsf@gnus.org> <87pmf64beo.fsf@gnus.org> <87h70i4a46.fsf@gnus.org> <87czb648r9.fsf@gnus.org> <874jwi47l6.fsf@gnus.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="38325"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: Eli Zaretskii , rlb@defaultvalue.org, monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, david@tethera.net, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Lars Ingebrigtsen Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Oct 05 18:10:36 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1og6yh-0009j0-VD for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 05 Oct 2022 18:10:35 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:36830 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1og6yg-0006ap-Ps for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 05 Oct 2022 12:10:34 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:50788) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1og6tB-0001if-JH for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 05 Oct 2022 12:04:53 -0400 Original-Received: from mx.sdf.org ([205.166.94.24]:63909) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1og6t9-0008Nw-E9; Wed, 05 Oct 2022 12:04:53 -0400 Original-Received: from ma.sdf.org (ma.sdf.org [205.166.94.33]) by mx.sdf.org (8.15.2/8.14.5) with ESMTPS id 295G4kgb003235 (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256 bits) verified NO); Wed, 5 Oct 2022 16:04:46 GMT In-Reply-To: <874jwi47l6.fsf@gnus.org> (Lars Ingebrigtsen's message of "Wed, 05 Oct 2022 17:24:05 +0200") Received-SPF: pass client-ip=205.166.94.24; envelope-from=akrl@sdf.org; helo=mx.sdf.org X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:296986 Archived-At: Lars Ingebrigtsen writes: > Andrea Corallo writes: > >> This is not the case at all, please trust me, your changeset does two >> things: >> >> 1- change the name a knob, but it goes from a maybe un-intuitive one to >> just (as explained) a plain wrong one. > > It goes from an un-intuitive (and undocumented) one to an > intuitively-named (and documented) one. The documentation topic is orthogonal, you could have improved `native-comp-deferred-compilation' documentation if you wanted. The naming went first to `inhibit-native-compilation', this was really just sooo wrong in so many levels :/ So many as many knobs we have to control and disable different parts of the native compiler. I can't really think of one understanding all this machinery and then picking up this name sorry, I can't. Then the name became `inhibit-automatic-native-compilation' that is fortunately just wrong on one level :/ The original name was the name of one of the two mechanisms concurring to native compilation, that is the reason why it was just not called "automatic". > In my opinion, the old variable > is just as wrong as the current one (because it seemed to imply that > compilation would be immediate instead of deferred). `native-comp-deferred-compilation' implies that native compilation can happen deferred. But anyway this name was reviewed and the name used here countless times for long time. Changing it with zero discussion is just not good cooperation spirit, sorry. You can think of it differently but you just risk to remain alone doing development. >> 2- add a mechanism that (as explained) cannot help with the user request >> in this discussion at all. > > And I've explained twice now that 2 is wrong -- these changes do exactly > what was requested: > > 1) It allows testing without writing to $HOME. (This has nothing to > do with --batch -- testing happens in interactive Emacsen, too.) The user request is for non interactive sessions AFAIU. And still I've to understand exactly what the user wants to solve. Most importantly I feel I'm not alone here. > 2) It allows people to run an AOT Emacs without triggering further > compilation. Sorry as changeset I meant 5fec9182db + f97993ee66. I'm not against e245c4f226. > If you have a suggestion for an alternative change that achieves these > two things, I'm all ears. (But if your objection is "people shouldn't > want those two things", I'm down to just two ears again.) Again 5fec9182db + f97993ee66 are IMO not useful / wrong, they were not discussed and are just a step backward. The best change I can suggest is to revert them now. Thanks Andrea