From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Andy Moreton Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Emacs rewrite in a maintainable language Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 14:28:59 +0100 Message-ID: References: <561A19AB.5060001@cumego.com> <87io6dl0h0.fsf@wanadoo.es> <87lhb82qxc.fsf@gmail.com> <878u78b3hg.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <87h9lwyv33.fsf@gmail.com> <561C368F.6010306@cs.ucla.edu> <87oag3xb2i.fsf@gmail.com> <561D241E.1010902@cs.ucla.edu> <87vbaaagr5.fsf@gmail.com> <86io6amqhd.fsf@gmail.com> <8737xdoogj.fsf@gmail.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1444829394 1753 80.91.229.3 (14 Oct 2015 13:29:54 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2015 13:29:54 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Oct 14 15:29:54 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1ZmM7t-0000pj-3W for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 14 Oct 2015 15:29:53 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:42461 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZmM7s-000162-Gv for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 14 Oct 2015 09:29:52 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:39585) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZmM7M-0000Oa-ID for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 14 Oct 2015 09:29:26 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZmM7I-0008Kt-EE for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 14 Oct 2015 09:29:20 -0400 Original-Received: from plane.gmane.org ([80.91.229.3]:54829) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZmM7I-0008Kk-7p for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 14 Oct 2015 09:29:16 -0400 Original-Received: from list by plane.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1ZmM78-00009T-KO for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 14 Oct 2015 15:29:06 +0200 Original-Received: from uk.solarflare.com ([193.34.186.16]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Wed, 14 Oct 2015 15:29:06 +0200 Original-Received: from andrewjmoreton by uk.solarflare.com with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Wed, 14 Oct 2015 15:29:06 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Original-Lines: 62 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: uk.solarflare.com User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.0.50 (windows-nt) Cancel-Lock: sha1:kJGlMjJNVeP7cZu4ULkyZayHkBQ= X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 80.91.229.3 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:191561 Archived-At: On Wed 14 Oct 2015, Oleh Krehel wrote: > Andy Moreton writes: > >> On Tue 13 Oct 2015, Oleh Krehel wrote: >> >>> Paul Eggert writes: >>> >>>> Oleh Krehel wrote: >>>>> I'd like to switch all const >>>>> pointers to a single "const char *" style. >>>> >>>> Let's not. It's more consistent to put 'const' after the type it >>>> modifies, and if we're going to have a "standard" style, that's the >>>> one we should have. >>> >>> "const char *" style is used in 85.9% of the cases. If you want to >>> revert those uses to "char const *" I'll support you, since I want the >>> consistency of a single style. >> >> Consistency is helpful, but pointless churn makes version history less >> useful, so please don't make this kind of change unless you are also >> making a semantic change to that area of the code. > > One commit is pointless churn? > >>>> But really, we have better things to do. >>> >>> I don't. I have no problem spending time to replace "char const *" into >>> "const char *". Browsing through a code base that I want to get familiar >>> with and fixing a small annoyance doesn't sound bad to me. >> >> Pointless churn. Find something that fixes an bug, or adds a useful new >> feature, and work on that. You will find it more rewarding, and other >> users and developers will find your contribution more helpful. > > I don't care about pleasing the user or developer gods. I want to do > what's helpful for me, and I think that change would be. I'm offering to > do the work for free, and currently I'm not offering any other work as > an alternative. You either want the improvement or not. The concerns for > opportunity cost are irrelevant here. Changes of this nature often turn into bikeshedding (where developers disagree about the one true style), or an endless series of small changes to modify code style (if style checker tools are not used). All of this make it harder to follow the history when trying to find how the behaviour has changed across versions. That is a cost that comes with an otherwise harmless change. > Very often I see /harmless/ suggestions turned down as not worth it, > both on this list and on debbugs. This isn't a good way to move forward > if we want to expand the base of developers and bug-reporting users. It is not cost-free, as noted above. By all means update the style to be consistent across the codebase, as long as you introduce a style checker that can automatically enforce the agreed style. As there have been dissenting voices in this thread, it seems your preferred style does not meet with universal approval. AndyM