From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Russian letters Date: Sat, 08 Jul 2006 19:06:57 +0300 Message-ID: References: <200607052110.21816.pogonyshev@gmx.net> <200607072259.40276.pogonyshev@gmx.net> <200607081830.12937.pogonyshev@gmx.net> Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii NNTP-Posting-Host: main.gmane.org X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1152374842 29714 80.91.229.2 (8 Jul 2006 16:07:22 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 8 Jul 2006 16:07:22 +0000 (UTC) Cc: handa@m17n.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Jul 08 18:07:21 2006 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by ciao.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1FzFKv-000327-Rh for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 08 Jul 2006 18:07:18 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1FzFKv-0005Sd-DI for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 08 Jul 2006 12:07:17 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1FzFKk-0005SY-W0 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 08 Jul 2006 12:07:07 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1FzFKi-0005S0-K2 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 08 Jul 2006 12:07:05 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1FzFKi-0005Rt-HN for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 08 Jul 2006 12:07:04 -0400 Original-Received: from [192.114.186.20] (helo=nitzan.inter.net.il) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1FzFLN-0008Jh-SS for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 08 Jul 2006 12:07:46 -0400 Original-Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 (IGLD-80-230-70-118.inter.net.il [80.230.70.118]) by nitzan.inter.net.il (MOS 3.7.3-GA) with ESMTP id EBD73920 (AUTH halo1); Sat, 8 Jul 2006 19:06:58 +0300 (IDT) Original-To: Paul Pogonyshev In-reply-to: <200607081830.12937.pogonyshev@gmx.net> (message from Paul Pogonyshev on Sat, 8 Jul 2006 18:30:12 +0300) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:56803 Archived-At: > From: Paul Pogonyshev > Date: Sat, 8 Jul 2006 18:30:12 +0300 > Cc: handa@m17n.org > > Eli Zaretskii wrote: > > > From: Paul Pogonyshev > > > Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2006 22:59:40 +0300 > > > > > > > utf-fragment-on-decoding's value is nil > > > > > > > > Whether or not to decode some chars in UTF-8/16 text into iso8859 charsets. > > > > [...] > > > > > > Why not do the same to the typed characters? > > > > Maybe it does, let's find out: how did you type those characters? Did > > you use a Leim input method (which one?), or did you type them on your > > keyboard? > > I think it is Leim input method `russian-computer'. I.e. I use `C-\' in > Emacs to switch between US Engish and Russian keyboard layouts. Handa-san, should Leim obey utf-fragment-on-decoding? I think it should, but maybe there's some complication that prevents it. > No matter how the characters are encoded, if they conceptually are > the same, they should be displayed using the same method, no? Ideally, yes. However, this is a harsh requirement: a font assumes a certain encoding of a character, so Emacs cannot easily use another font if it's for a different encoding. > Cronyx fonts do indeed support Russian characters. However, customizing > `default' face to use cronyx-courier for some reason influences only the > current Emacs session. Bug? Probably. I'll let Handa-san to answer this. > Actually, I now see that I had this problem before and wrote about it in > ``Pango-like font fallback (was Re: Russian numero sign)'' thread: > > I went to install all the fonts I could find in my Debian Sarge. And > found cronyx-courier font, which looks nice _and_ has Cyrillic > characters. However, when I customize the default face in Emacs and > set that font family, latin characters are still displayed in > adobe-courier (though Cyrillic ones are shown in cronyx-courier)... > And the customization doesn't take any effect after I restart Emacs... > Any ideas? > > Kenichi Handa answered: > > Perhaps that because you don't have > -cronyx-courier-...-iso8859-1. Emacs by default uses an > iso8859-1 font for ASCII. To change it, you must create a > proper fontset by one of these ways: [...] > > How an average user is supposed to find it is beyond me. They shouldn't. But I think Debian should add a -cronyx-courier font for Latin-1, because without that Emacs is broken for Cyrillic scripts. Or maybe there's some other Unicode font that covers both Cyrillic and Latin-1.