From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: "What's This?" in Describe submenu Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 22:34:57 +0300 Message-ID: References: <4308398B.60401@gmx.at> <200508230008.j7N081514425@raven.dms.auburn.edu> <200508230456.j7N4u6x14879@raven.dms.auburn.edu> Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii NNTP-Posting-Host: main.gmane.org X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1124826239 13898 80.91.229.2 (23 Aug 2005 19:43:59 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2005 19:43:59 +0000 (UTC) Cc: rudalics@gmx.at, emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Aug 23 21:43:56 2005 Return-path: Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by ciao.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1E7efW-0007Yj-07 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 23 Aug 2005 21:42:46 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1E7ejI-0004cA-U4 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 23 Aug 2005 15:46:40 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1E7ehb-00040x-Kb for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 23 Aug 2005 15:44:56 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1E7ehW-0003yB-4H for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 23 Aug 2005 15:44:50 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1E7ehV-0003pN-SX for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 23 Aug 2005 15:44:49 -0400 Original-Received: from [192.114.186.20] (helo=nitzan.inter.net.il) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1E7eYt-00081F-9A for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 23 Aug 2005 15:35:55 -0400 Original-Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 (IGLD-80-230-203-14.inter.net.il [80.230.203.14]) by nitzan.inter.net.il (MOS 3.6.5-GR) with ESMTP id BFW03931 (AUTH halo1); Tue, 23 Aug 2005 22:34:58 +0300 (IDT) Original-To: Luc Teirlinck In-reply-to: <200508230456.j7N4u6x14879@raven.dms.auburn.edu> (message from Luc Teirlinck on Mon, 22 Aug 2005 23:56:06 -0500 (CDT)) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:42361 Archived-At: > Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 23:56:06 -0500 (CDT) > From: Luc Teirlinck > Cc: rudalics@gmx.at, emacs-devel@gnu.org > > "If you click mouse-1 on the minibuffer or fringe, the KDE user (and > Lennart claimed the Microsoft user too) would expect a tooltip > telling what the minibuffer/echo area or fringe are for. But I already gave an example (a typical one, AFAICS) which clearly shows that the tooltip popped by IE says what the click on that place _does_, not what that place _is_. It's true that, for a button, the difference is minor, but still... Perhaps you should re-read the example I gave. Here's the most important part of that text again: Click this to delete all cookies from your machine. This says what the click does, not what the place where you click is. Suppose clicking on the left fringe would say something like A mouse-1 click on this area, called ``the fringe'', sets a breakpoint on the nearest source line shown. Isn't this the same as what IE says above? Now compare with what Emacs _really_ displays for that fringe click: (translated from ) runs the command gdb-mouse-set-clear-breakpoint Set/clear breakpoint in left fringe/margin with mouse click. Isn't this similar in spirit? Now, I agree that what we say sounds not very clear (to say the least) to a newbie, but I think we do mean to target newbies as well, and that therefore we should work on making the doc string more newbie-friendly. But I'm repeating myself...