From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Christopher Dimech Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Emacs Survey: Toolbars Date: Tue, 15 Dec 2020 17:12:20 +0100 Message-ID: References: <87o8iv3ac3.fsf@gnus.org> <877dpjp30g.fsf@ucl.ac.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="21489"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Eric S Fraga Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Tue Dec 15 17:14:53 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1kpCyT-0005Sg-F5 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Tue, 15 Dec 2020 17:14:53 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:44108 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kpCyS-0004cr-GC for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Tue, 15 Dec 2020 11:14:52 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:36842) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kpCw8-0002MS-Kx for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 15 Dec 2020 11:12:28 -0500 Original-Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.15]:41313) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kpCw5-0001iP-5E for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 15 Dec 2020 11:12:28 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=gmx.net; s=badeba3b8450; t=1608048740; bh=oS3hl0UiWx0kzgEA9Rm31ngbEUVi5u90Ojx04v/jXs8=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:In-Reply-To:References; b=P+n3/jXqQ5d0tlLHyXy1sxagcXV8WF1Fm4HvCf4vGxdMdOV/q6GGScARe76bnJ2gJ 3lKxOrlnAJx3xaiVKmTbwhQECGusrQr4PmqK1977q7M7ZVliEGtwBudQBrl4R/dodK Hky9Lwht9+E7Mg7Scn+HGqr8Z1mgoWOBDRa7rF/o= X-UI-Sender-Class: 01bb95c1-4bf8-414a-932a-4f6e2808ef9c Original-Received: from [213.165.168.94] ([213.165.168.94]) by web-mail.gmx.net (3c-app-mailcom-bs15.server.lan [172.19.170.183]) (via HTTP); Tue, 15 Dec 2020 17:12:20 +0100 Importance: normal Sensitivity: Normal In-Reply-To: <877dpjp30g.fsf@ucl.ac.uk> X-UI-Message-Type: mail X-Priority: 3 X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:TRImeFn3c4+bWDFfYYs0fVONDHmafwXlcyIOoAYNQo7vAiE2+tPlcW5YaV5CrsGHjuymN iuco8FooSdyWlkRIlWxWBwCfdKlE+VFQDaxxbi9unGJZf/3ySX7xBIv/IojiafYCAVvM+MOBL6Ru sO5gO/SguJUXGkWbzMmywKzvTWfWlnZ1FhJ+YPGsprZVgj9xGWAgs2rRHu53WmE6h7Ew0dTy5PBR Sp4GGPR8MluLqqB9C89NZ8g1q10aTK1NfFG5lStox7GBirCFLZGe4Xm2TydjspnUVLMWX0vSfT6L LM= X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:1rcAzwhiEXg=:XZTCk8n9CO2ELEyyY2UFGs hLnhXOw/FPZyVISdxsMkIG3d9gZzs2TPAysBrRKHbiKLSYftlHAyK7upohkTN8ftSvHa+BIHP rgtk0oPcG8sC/7DXVWn099I80BNtdZvjU3g25hjteK2JJUdDu/cGu2XejsbVDSYE5E0T7RiZ7 VRKTalq34mnEI5hwG2nD8t4rmeXFaP8q8VXuBAWaPIi/PZjnM79bQRJkNKq12vQWM4RgOA0Dn BmSuFey4fkXeVF3qOFWNJLdjAv/Hn+kLimYQYgu3mQMsWd1oO9Pr8B+jtB0pgIR7WvaCGUHmO bCrHX/+Tf2UlpR3KIUZERFIAevYm2kjBm3zOcGYbL5LMTN9UBdHyEBxZLSufVPp+IsJfsJJlV EupOMR2CbjiXQzkyzwHZx1V40etzkLeJ642BCub0veCQNGST+7xZxJYjjk47WM7pFs0o4DWxe LcSNZlO3AHUDeBnVwx0hSlxu7fLIkd41FEXngnP/dpo6x2tw/gR9I0OBoPOVCiZJ3v63DM6eA GBLM7oUOcoEXz8kaiPh6ihRWfvNRBL16PfTsGjjVzn9mOdWiDMEqET6i9+i1VUzHno5drzb+Q D8hs/7PxU1VcU= Received-SPF: pass client-ip=212.227.15.15; envelope-from=dimech@gmx.com; helo=mout.gmx.net X-Spam_score_int: -25 X-Spam_score: -2.6 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.6 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:260875 Archived-At: > Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2020 at 3:17 PM > From: "Eric S Fraga" > To: emacs-devel@gnu.org > Subject: Re: Emacs Survey: Toolbars > > Although I disabled the toolbar when it first appeared (in the dim and > distant past), I think it's a good idea to leave them on by > default. They are easy enough to disable and provide help for the true > neophyte. In fact, learning how to disable the toolbar is probably a > good first exercise in customizing your Emacs! Quite correct. If we really want to modernise emacs, we got to become serious. There is a section of people who do not want graphical elements, and the question was there mainly to appease programmers who want old style customisation (no menu, no scrollbars, etc). Toolbars are there so people who use the mouse can enable frequently used commands using the mouse. If the plan is enhancement, then. 1. Let Emacs enable people to add things to the toolbar for commands, without having to use elisp programming. The survey suggests that those focused on elisp are a minority. > Eric S Fraga via Emacs 28.0.50 & org 9.4 on Debian bullseye/sid > > >