* Origin of IVD_Sequences.txt
@ 2014-10-21 14:31 Rob Browning
2014-10-21 15:24 ` Eli Zaretskii
0 siblings, 1 reply; 21+ messages in thread
From: Rob Browning @ 2014-10-21 14:31 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: emacs-devel
What's the upstream source for this file?
I ask because the license is included by URL reference, and from a
preliminary look, the applicable terms of that license appear to vary
depending on the original source (path) of the file.
Thanks
--
Rob Browning
rlb @defaultvalue.org and @debian.org
GPG as of 2011-07-10 E6A9 DA3C C9FD 1FF8 C676 D2C4 C0F0 39E9 ED1B 597A
GPG as of 2002-11-03 14DD 432F AE39 534D B592 F9A0 25C8 D377 8C7E 73A4
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Origin of IVD_Sequences.txt
2014-10-21 14:31 Origin of IVD_Sequences.txt Rob Browning
@ 2014-10-21 15:24 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-10-21 15:45 ` Rob Browning
0 siblings, 1 reply; 21+ messages in thread
From: Eli Zaretskii @ 2014-10-21 15:24 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Rob Browning; +Cc: emacs-devel
> From: Rob Browning <rlb@defaultvalue.org>
> Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2014 09:31:59 -0500
>
>
> What's the upstream source for this file?
The license for all data files distributed by the Unicode Consortium
is here:
http://www.unicode.org/copyright.html#Exhibit1
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Origin of IVD_Sequences.txt
2014-10-21 15:24 ` Eli Zaretskii
@ 2014-10-21 15:45 ` Rob Browning
2014-10-21 17:43 ` Eli Zaretskii
0 siblings, 1 reply; 21+ messages in thread
From: Rob Browning @ 2014-10-21 15:45 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Eli Zaretskii; +Cc: emacs-devel
Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:
> The license for all data files distributed by the Unicode Consortium
> is here:
>
> http://www.unicode.org/copyright.html#Exhibit1
I saw that, and guessed the file was covered by Exhibit 1, but needed to
determine that for sure. i.e. from which path listed in Exhibit 1 does
it originate?
Unicode Data Files include all data files under the directories
http://www.unicode.org/Public/, http://www.unicode.org/reports/, and
http://www.unicode.org/cldr/data/. Unicode Data Files do not include PDF
online code charts under the directory
http://www.unicode.org/Public/. Software includes any source code
published in the Unicode Standard or under the directories
http://www.unicode.org/Public/, http://www.unicode.org/reports/, and
http://www.unicode.org/cldr/data/.
(I did see that the file is referred to by the report (UTS 37), which is
under http://www.unicode.org/reports/ (and hence likely covered by
Exhibit 1), but assuming I didn't overlook it, the actual content of
IVD_Sequences.txt isn't actually in that report.)
In any case, I haven't done a full recursive search of all the paths
listed above yet, since I suspected someone here would already know the
details.
Thanks
--
Rob Browning
rlb @defaultvalue.org and @debian.org
GPG as of 2011-07-10 E6A9 DA3C C9FD 1FF8 C676 D2C4 C0F0 39E9 ED1B 597A
GPG as of 2002-11-03 14DD 432F AE39 534D B592 F9A0 25C8 D377 8C7E 73A4
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Origin of IVD_Sequences.txt
2014-10-21 15:45 ` Rob Browning
@ 2014-10-21 17:43 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-10-21 17:53 ` Rob Browning
0 siblings, 1 reply; 21+ messages in thread
From: Eli Zaretskii @ 2014-10-21 17:43 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Rob Browning; +Cc: emacs-devel
> From: Rob Browning <rlb@defaultvalue.org>
> Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org
> Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2014 10:45:51 -0500
>
> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:
>
> > The license for all data files distributed by the Unicode Consortium
> > is here:
> >
> > http://www.unicode.org/copyright.html#Exhibit1
>
> I saw that, and guessed the file was covered by Exhibit 1, but needed to
> determine that for sure. i.e. from which path listed in Exhibit 1 does
> it originate?
The file is in http://www.unicode.org/ivd/.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Origin of IVD_Sequences.txt
2014-10-21 17:43 ` Eli Zaretskii
@ 2014-10-21 17:53 ` Rob Browning
2014-10-21 18:02 ` Eli Zaretskii
0 siblings, 1 reply; 21+ messages in thread
From: Rob Browning @ 2014-10-21 17:53 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Eli Zaretskii; +Cc: emacs-devel
Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:
> The file is in http://www.unicode.org/ivd/.
As far as I can tell, that's not listed as one of the Exhibit 1 paths.
Is there some other reason we know it's Exhibit 1 material?
i.e. perhaps it's "source code published in the Unicode Standard", or
it's also included within one of the listed paths?
Thanks
--
Rob Browning
rlb @defaultvalue.org and @debian.org
GPG as of 2011-07-10 E6A9 DA3C C9FD 1FF8 C676 D2C4 C0F0 39E9 ED1B 597A
GPG as of 2002-11-03 14DD 432F AE39 534D B592 F9A0 25C8 D377 8C7E 73A4
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Origin of IVD_Sequences.txt
2014-10-21 17:53 ` Rob Browning
@ 2014-10-21 18:02 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-10-21 18:08 ` Rob Browning
2014-10-21 19:51 ` Glenn Morris
0 siblings, 2 replies; 21+ messages in thread
From: Eli Zaretskii @ 2014-10-21 18:02 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Rob Browning; +Cc: emacs-devel
> From: Rob Browning <rlb@defaultvalue.org>
> Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org
> Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2014 12:53:35 -0500
>
> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:
>
> > The file is in http://www.unicode.org/ivd/.
>
> As far as I can tell, that's not listed as one of the Exhibit 1 paths.
> Is there some other reason we know it's Exhibit 1 material?
It's a data file.
Look, if you need the definitive legal opinion, please ask the Unicode
guys.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Origin of IVD_Sequences.txt
2014-10-21 18:02 ` Eli Zaretskii
@ 2014-10-21 18:08 ` Rob Browning
2014-10-21 19:07 ` Glenn Morris
2014-10-21 19:51 ` Glenn Morris
1 sibling, 1 reply; 21+ messages in thread
From: Rob Browning @ 2014-10-21 18:08 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Eli Zaretskii; +Cc: emacs-devel
Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> writes:
> It's a data file.
>
> Look, if you need the definitive legal opinion, please ask the Unicode
> guys.
OK, thanks -- I just thought it'd already be known, and was trying to
expedite the Debian 24.4 packaging, since the Debian ftpmasters will
consider the question before inclusion.
--
Rob Browning
rlb @defaultvalue.org and @debian.org
GPG as of 2011-07-10 E6A9 DA3C C9FD 1FF8 C676 D2C4 C0F0 39E9 ED1B 597A
GPG as of 2002-11-03 14DD 432F AE39 534D B592 F9A0 25C8 D377 8C7E 73A4
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Origin of IVD_Sequences.txt
2014-10-21 18:08 ` Rob Browning
@ 2014-10-21 19:07 ` Glenn Morris
2014-10-21 19:31 ` Rob Browning
0 siblings, 1 reply; 21+ messages in thread
From: Glenn Morris @ 2014-10-21 19:07 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Rob Browning; +Cc: Eli Zaretskii, emacs-devel
The answer is not immediately obvious to me either.
I hope this doesn't turn into one of Those Issues...
Hopefully it is just an oversight/lack of clarity on the unicode website.
But it's only used for Emacs on Mac OS X, so if it speeds things up you
could just strip it (and src/macuvs.h) out from your packages.
Obviously that's more work; sorry.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Origin of IVD_Sequences.txt
2014-10-21 19:07 ` Glenn Morris
@ 2014-10-21 19:31 ` Rob Browning
0 siblings, 0 replies; 21+ messages in thread
From: Rob Browning @ 2014-10-21 19:31 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Glenn Morris; +Cc: Eli Zaretskii, emacs-devel
Glenn Morris <rgm@gnu.org> writes:
> But it's only used for Emacs on Mac OS X, so if it speeds things up you
> could just strip it (and src/macuvs.h) out from your packages.
> Obviously that's more work; sorry.
Actually, for us, I think that should be trivially easy right now.
Thanks
--
Rob Browning
rlb @defaultvalue.org and @debian.org
GPG as of 2011-07-10 E6A9 DA3C C9FD 1FF8 C676 D2C4 C0F0 39E9 ED1B 597A
GPG as of 2002-11-03 14DD 432F AE39 534D B592 F9A0 25C8 D377 8C7E 73A4
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Origin of IVD_Sequences.txt
2014-10-21 18:02 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-10-21 18:08 ` Rob Browning
@ 2014-10-21 19:51 ` Glenn Morris
2014-10-21 20:02 ` Rob Browning
` (2 more replies)
1 sibling, 3 replies; 21+ messages in thread
From: Glenn Morris @ 2014-10-21 19:51 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Eli Zaretskii; +Cc: Rob Browning, emacs-devel
Eli Zaretskii wrote:
> Look, if you need the definitive legal opinion, please ask the Unicode
> guys.
Do you know what address to use for that?
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Origin of IVD_Sequences.txt
2014-10-21 19:51 ` Glenn Morris
@ 2014-10-21 20:02 ` Rob Browning
2014-10-21 20:15 ` Glenn Morris
2014-10-21 20:11 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-10-22 22:47 ` Richard Stallman
2 siblings, 1 reply; 21+ messages in thread
From: Rob Browning @ 2014-10-21 20:02 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Glenn Morris, Eli Zaretskii; +Cc: emacs-devel
Glenn Morris <rgm@gnu.org> writes:
> Do you know what address to use for that?
There was at least a contact link on the site (hidden without
javascript) that leads here:
http://www.unicode.org/reporting.html
--
Rob Browning
rlb @defaultvalue.org and @debian.org
GPG as of 2011-07-10 E6A9 DA3C C9FD 1FF8 C676 D2C4 C0F0 39E9 ED1B 597A
GPG as of 2002-11-03 14DD 432F AE39 534D B592 F9A0 25C8 D377 8C7E 73A4
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Origin of IVD_Sequences.txt
2014-10-21 19:51 ` Glenn Morris
2014-10-21 20:02 ` Rob Browning
@ 2014-10-21 20:11 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-10-22 22:47 ` Richard Stallman
2 siblings, 0 replies; 21+ messages in thread
From: Eli Zaretskii @ 2014-10-21 20:11 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Glenn Morris; +Cc: rlb, emacs-devel
> From: Glenn Morris <rgm@gnu.org>
> Cc: Rob Browning <rlb@defaultvalue.org>, emacs-devel@gnu.org
> Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2014 15:51:21 -0400
>
> Eli Zaretskii wrote:
>
> > Look, if you need the definitive legal opinion, please ask the Unicode
> > guys.
>
> Do you know what address to use for that?
Surprisingly, unicode@unicode.org.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Origin of IVD_Sequences.txt
2014-10-21 20:02 ` Rob Browning
@ 2014-10-21 20:15 ` Glenn Morris
2014-10-21 20:31 ` Rob Browning
2014-10-22 0:44 ` Paul Eggert
0 siblings, 2 replies; 21+ messages in thread
From: Glenn Morris @ 2014-10-21 20:15 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Rob Browning; +Cc: Eli Zaretskii, emacs-devel
Rob Browning wrote:
> There was at least a contact link on the site (hidden without
> javascript) that leads here:
>
> http://www.unicode.org/reporting.html
Thanks. Did you/will you ask them?
Otherwise I will do it, but probably not right now.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Origin of IVD_Sequences.txt
2014-10-21 20:15 ` Glenn Morris
@ 2014-10-21 20:31 ` Rob Browning
2014-10-22 0:44 ` Paul Eggert
1 sibling, 0 replies; 21+ messages in thread
From: Rob Browning @ 2014-10-21 20:31 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Glenn Morris; +Cc: Eli Zaretskii, emacs-devel
Glenn Morris <rgm@gnu.org> writes:
> Thanks. Did you/will you ask them?
> Otherwise I will do it, but probably not right now.
I haven't yet, and probably won't immediately.
Thanks
--
Rob Browning
rlb @defaultvalue.org and @debian.org
GPG as of 2011-07-10 E6A9 DA3C C9FD 1FF8 C676 D2C4 C0F0 39E9 ED1B 597A
GPG as of 2002-11-03 14DD 432F AE39 534D B592 F9A0 25C8 D377 8C7E 73A4
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Origin of IVD_Sequences.txt
2014-10-21 20:15 ` Glenn Morris
2014-10-21 20:31 ` Rob Browning
@ 2014-10-22 0:44 ` Paul Eggert
2018-08-23 5:15 ` Rob Browning
1 sibling, 1 reply; 21+ messages in thread
From: Paul Eggert @ 2014-10-22 0:44 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Glenn Morris, Rob Browning; +Cc: Eli Zaretskii, emacs-devel
Glenn Morris wrote:
>> http://www.unicode.org/reporting.html
>
> Thanks. Did you/will you ask them?
> Otherwise I will do it, but probably not right now.
I just now asked them there.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Origin of IVD_Sequences.txt
2014-10-21 19:51 ` Glenn Morris
2014-10-21 20:02 ` Rob Browning
2014-10-21 20:11 ` Eli Zaretskii
@ 2014-10-22 22:47 ` Richard Stallman
2014-10-23 17:20 ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2 siblings, 1 reply; 21+ messages in thread
From: Richard Stallman @ 2014-10-22 22:47 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Glenn Morris; +Cc: eliz, rlb, emacs-devel
[[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]]
[[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]]
[[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]]
In this case, asking the Unicode Consortium seems reasonable.
However, in general, people should not be quick to ask some other
party for its interpretation of some license. If there might be a
dispute with some other organization, we should get legal advice from
our own lawyers, not from their lawyers.
--
Dr Richard Stallman
President, Free Software Foundation
51 Franklin St
Boston MA 02110
USA
www.fsf.org www.gnu.org
Skype: No way! That's nonfree (freedom-denying) software.
Use Ekiga or an ordinary phone call.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Origin of IVD_Sequences.txt
2014-10-22 22:47 ` Richard Stallman
@ 2014-10-23 17:20 ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2014-10-24 14:15 ` Richard Stallman
0 siblings, 1 reply; 21+ messages in thread
From: Stephen J. Turnbull @ 2014-10-23 17:20 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: rms; +Cc: emacs-devel
Richard Stallman writes:
> In this case, asking the Unicode Consortium seems reasonable.
> However, in general, people should not be quick to ask some other
> party for its interpretation of some license.
Is there a question of interpretation here? I thought that the issue
was whether the license applies at all or not (AIUI it appears not to
apply, although IMO the intent is for it to apply), which is legally
quite a different kettle of fish.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Origin of IVD_Sequences.txt
2014-10-23 17:20 ` Stephen J. Turnbull
@ 2014-10-24 14:15 ` Richard Stallman
0 siblings, 0 replies; 21+ messages in thread
From: Richard Stallman @ 2014-10-24 14:15 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Stephen J. Turnbull; +Cc: emacs-devel
[[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]]
[[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]]
[[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]]
> In this case, asking the Unicode Consortium seems reasonable.
> However, in general, people should not be quick to ask some other
> party for its interpretation of some license.
Is there a question of interpretation here? I thought that the issue
was whether the license applies at all or not (AIUI it appears not to
apply, although IMO the intent is for it to apply), which is legally
quite a different kettle of fish.
What I said applies to ANY legal question about
dealing with some other entity's publications or claims.
--
Dr Richard Stallman
President, Free Software Foundation
51 Franklin St
Boston MA 02110
USA
www.fsf.org www.gnu.org
Skype: No way! That's nonfree (freedom-denying) software.
Use Ekiga or an ordinary phone call.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Origin of IVD_Sequences.txt
2014-10-22 0:44 ` Paul Eggert
@ 2018-08-23 5:15 ` Rob Browning
2018-08-23 6:47 ` Paul Eggert
0 siblings, 1 reply; 21+ messages in thread
From: Rob Browning @ 2018-08-23 5:15 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Paul Eggert, Glenn Morris; +Cc: Eli Zaretskii, emacs-devel
Paul Eggert <eggert@cs.ucla.edu> writes:
> Glenn Morris wrote:
>
>>> http://www.unicode.org/reporting.html
>>
>> Thanks. Did you/will you ask them?
>> Otherwise I will do it, but probably not right now.
>
> I just now asked them there.
Hey, did you ever hear anything back? I ask because I'm working on
merging emacs-26.1 into Debian and it looks like there may be
additional, related files.
Thanks
--
Rob Browning
rlb @defaultvalue.org and @debian.org
GPG as of 2011-07-10 E6A9 DA3C C9FD 1FF8 C676 D2C4 C0F0 39E9 ED1B 597A
GPG as of 2002-11-03 14DD 432F AE39 534D B592 F9A0 25C8 D377 8C7E 73A4
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Origin of IVD_Sequences.txt
2018-08-23 5:15 ` Rob Browning
@ 2018-08-23 6:47 ` Paul Eggert
2018-08-24 3:16 ` Rob Browning
0 siblings, 1 reply; 21+ messages in thread
From: Paul Eggert @ 2018-08-23 6:47 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Rob Browning, Glenn Morris; +Cc: Eli Zaretskii, emacs-devel
Rob Browning wrote:
> Hey, did you ever hear anything back?
Not that I recall, no.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
* Re: Origin of IVD_Sequences.txt
2018-08-23 6:47 ` Paul Eggert
@ 2018-08-24 3:16 ` Rob Browning
0 siblings, 0 replies; 21+ messages in thread
From: Rob Browning @ 2018-08-24 3:16 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Paul Eggert, Glenn Morris; +Cc: Eli Zaretskii, emacs-devel
Paul Eggert <eggert@cs.ucla.edu> writes:
> Rob Browning wrote:
>> Hey, did you ever hear anything back?
>
> Not that I recall, no.
OK, thanks. I suppose we'll see what's involved in separating them.
For what it's worth, it looks like in Debian we'll also need to separate
etc/schema/od-manifest-schema-v1.2-os.rnc
etc/schema/od-schema-v1.2-os.rnc
from main because they appear to allow no modifications.
Thanks
--
Rob Browning
rlb @defaultvalue.org and @debian.org
GPG as of 2011-07-10 E6A9 DA3C C9FD 1FF8 C676 D2C4 C0F0 39E9 ED1B 597A
GPG as of 2002-11-03 14DD 432F AE39 534D B592 F9A0 25C8 D377 8C7E 73A4
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 21+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2018-08-24 3:16 UTC | newest]
Thread overview: 21+ messages (download: mbox.gz follow: Atom feed
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2014-10-21 14:31 Origin of IVD_Sequences.txt Rob Browning
2014-10-21 15:24 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-10-21 15:45 ` Rob Browning
2014-10-21 17:43 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-10-21 17:53 ` Rob Browning
2014-10-21 18:02 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-10-21 18:08 ` Rob Browning
2014-10-21 19:07 ` Glenn Morris
2014-10-21 19:31 ` Rob Browning
2014-10-21 19:51 ` Glenn Morris
2014-10-21 20:02 ` Rob Browning
2014-10-21 20:15 ` Glenn Morris
2014-10-21 20:31 ` Rob Browning
2014-10-22 0:44 ` Paul Eggert
2018-08-23 5:15 ` Rob Browning
2018-08-23 6:47 ` Paul Eggert
2018-08-24 3:16 ` Rob Browning
2014-10-21 20:11 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-10-22 22:47 ` Richard Stallman
2014-10-23 17:20 ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2014-10-24 14:15 ` Richard Stallman
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