From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Per Abrahamsen Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: reducing defface redundancy Date: Sun, 21 Apr 2002 11:12:52 +0200 Organization: The Church of Emacs Sender: emacs-devel-admin@gnu.org Message-ID: References: <877kn3qczq.fsf@tc-1-100.kawasaki.gol.ne.jp> <2950-Sat20Apr2002203550+0300-eliz@is.elta.co.il> NNTP-Posting-Host: localhost.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: main.gmane.org 1019380523 10292 127.0.0.1 (21 Apr 2002 09:15:23 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@main.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 21 Apr 2002 09:15:23 +0000 (UTC) Return-path: Original-Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([80.91.224.244]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1 (Debian)) id 16zDRL-0002ft-00 for ; Sun, 21 Apr 2002 11:15:23 +0200 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([199.232.76.164]) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 16zDRU-0001CX-00 for ; Sun, 21 Apr 2002 11:15:32 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=fencepost.gnu.org) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 3.34 #1 (Debian)) id 16zDRA-0001D4-00; Sun, 21 Apr 2002 05:15:12 -0400 Original-Received: from sheridan.dina.kvl.dk ([130.225.40.227]) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 3.34 #1 (Debian)) id 16zDOx-0001AA-00 for ; Sun, 21 Apr 2002 05:12:55 -0400 Original-Received: from zuse.dina.kvl.dk (zuse.dina.kvl.dk [130.225.40.245]) by sheridan.dina.kvl.dk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id LAA28828 for ; Sun, 21 Apr 2002 11:12:54 +0200 Original-Received: (from abraham@localhost) by zuse.dina.kvl.dk (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.3) id LAA03578; Sun, 21 Apr 2002 11:12:53 +0200 (MEST) X-Authentication-Warning: zuse.dina.kvl.dk: abraham set sender to abraham@dina.kvl.dk using -f Original-To: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Face: +kRV2]2q}lixHkE{U)mY#+6]{AH=yN~S9@IFiOa@X6?GM|8MBp/ In-Reply-To: <2950-Sat20Apr2002203550+0300-eliz@is.elta.co.il> ("Eli Zaretskii"'s message of "Sat, 20 Apr 2002 20:35:50 +0300") Original-Lines: 25 User-Agent: Gnus/5.090006 (Oort Gnus v0.06) Emacs/21.1 (sparc-sun-solaris2.8) Errors-To: emacs-devel-admin@gnu.org X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.9 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Emacs development discussions. List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:2917 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel:2917 "Eli Zaretskii" writes: >> From: Per Abrahamsen >> Date: Sat, 20 Apr 2002 17:59:41 +0200 >> >> It is really easy to invent all kinds of smart stuff to the defface >> spec at the Lisp level. Comming up with good UI is way harder. > > Sorry, I don't understand: what UI? defface is not a user-level > feature, it's a programmer feature. The primary purpose of defface is to give customize-face something to work on. Just like the primary purpose of defcustom is to give information to customize-variable. Otherwise, we could just as well use the pre-customize facilities for creating faces and variables. > Did you mean API, perhaps? Certainly NOT! There are a zillion convenient things one can do on the API level, that will translate badly or not at all to the UI. Design the UI *first*, then translate it to the API. The UI is the hard part.