From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "T.V Raman" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Emacs is very special regarding UIs Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2020 11:24:41 -0700 Message-ID: References: <87eenc1du2.fsf@blind.guru> <7wtuw5d5ho.fsf@junk.nocrew.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=gb18030 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="21472"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Lars Brinkhoff Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Sep 10 20:57:36 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1kGRlH-0005OP-Hd for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 20:57:35 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:34648 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kGRlG-0001L1-HT for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 14:57:34 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:59132) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kGRFZ-00022u-A8 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 14:24:49 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-pf1-x432.google.com ([2607:f8b0:4864:20::432]:41238) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kGRFX-0003SC-7e for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 14:24:48 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-pf1-x432.google.com with SMTP id z19so5112825pfn.8 for ; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 11:24:45 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20161025; h=from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id :user-agent:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=q0uJRe02KBnmaZKJe4QPIH2roMHEhOsZItt1O+wqWMc=; b=fwOUcHMB0yeSyGulfx383RotNy7hYiCRdw2yN1ieFdzhZS3npRCZshngZhVxVxqcTb OjujnIAXxvU4ae61e4mFyNdDiSAUILl6TwDEaU4gQJ0Jm5yUwIiM+TQHdAD4/kx7aM1H QgpfyRiOYLZV/d9XcUsQlJP2KlFdv9UQm9elXTsYMHSzNUfVxAJqjLzlP9PIrfq0xxBO 8+2u30rXVQgPmoXqg8Ts98UqGoGaxPML0J7e8+Tm4X/qv+AabZ4o/WRAoO90S6eKe9nL x77P/YACoHALR4GTpOmBhuiXw7JT/fNormi8FJXxiCrE37Jn0440B/G9pHPn3SQ8x/ER Pmjw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to :message-id:user-agent:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=q0uJRe02KBnmaZKJe4QPIH2roMHEhOsZItt1O+wqWMc=; b=O2s4sJ2bgyBd61YpAUbURkyW0IeEazkcX1VoNibvnI8stSCj15VkOfJQRrk9jx6JGN C/E1EEGaJuC9MQeU7hh/GgrXQj6CJYAOOrCYBn2JRNDxzNm3fXaQPWqAy/qIA+cEzYMI Uy5KnhkdOHQYh9d1wmSvsGugYgrWhl1WYhoq6iKkEPZR70mejAag2Lj+sIHVdIxObUHf vPY7Q0pNUQfeFW15e0C1gH3lXmrLYkJXKXMGmn1G90WAh+urXRc1TZyhgxSxiaHW81CZ hv1qEcaPJZucXPOhLlJxpvgTjQe0ZIoKfxi/WBT8nBYCv0Zc57iLbeWzSMdGn8hnbKfo A9nw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532CGa4/COrLqsYrNg9WfR+KqDEFSX0AAWCn5FitlhzMU6Q7Xa7w ptgHKeW5bbQRbDrh6mnUva5Naws3/Yn2//JH X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwQyBzFCKcJaeHXw8qAVBHbhimErp+3qhmjvAOL8DWaEXp2EBbBS4z1haMjdO0Krd5kKM/dDQ== X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:7886:: with SMTP id q6mr6867973pll.7.1599762283411; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 11:24:43 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from raman-glaptop.localdomain (c-24-4-174-65.hsd1.ca.comcast.net. [24.4.174.65]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id c199sm6657645pfc.128.2020.09.10.11.24.42 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Thu, 10 Sep 2020 11:24:42 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: by raman-glaptop.localdomain (Postfix, from userid 13930) id 66A72C20B78; Thu, 10 Sep 2020 11:24:41 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <7wtuw5d5ho.fsf@junk.nocrew.org> (Lars Brinkhoff's message of "Thu, 10 Sep 2020 15:19:15 +0000") Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::432; envelope-from=raman@google.com; helo=mail-pf1-x432.google.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: No matching host in p0f cache. That's all we know. X-Spam_score_int: -175 X-Spam_score: -17.6 X-Spam_bar: ----------------- X-Spam_report: (-17.6 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, ENV_AND_HDR_SPF_MATCH=-0.5, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5, USER_IN_DEF_SPF_WL=-7.5 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:255033 Archived-At: Lars Brinkhoff writes: The assertion that it's so because all they had then was text is seriously short-changing and even somewhat insulting to the thought that has likely gone into Emacs' design --- folks like RMS can likely speak to that more than I can. But Emacs does an outstanding job of separating content from presentation, has an embedded lisp machine, and enables that lisp machine to manipulate all information/content that flows through Emacs. >> Emacs works with graphical toolkits on all major platforms, but also >> offers a almost-feature-complete text interface. > > Emacs is a manifestation of the ITS user interfaces. They all relied on > text because that's all that was available back then. They also used > control characters, Altmode/Escape/Meta, and prefix arguments. > >> I am seeing Emacs as a platform to write "apps" in Emacs Lisp. > > In this sense, Emacs is a Lisp machine. Not surprisingly, those came > from the same place as ITS: the MIT AI Lab. > > --=20 =817=A94 Id: kg:/m/0285kf1 =950=DC8