From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Steve Youngs Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.sxemacs.devel,gmane.emacs.gnus.general,gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Moving Gnus development to Emacs Date: Thu, 31 Dec 2015 00:33:26 +1000 Organization: The SXEmacs Project Message-ID: References: NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="=-=-="; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature" X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1451486039 5384 80.91.229.3 (30 Dec 2015 14:33:59 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 30 Dec 2015 14:33:59 +0000 (UTC) Keywords: gnus,emacs,xemacs,repo,code,development,use,stuff Cc: yamaoka@jpl.org, sxemacs-devel@sxemacs.org, ding@gnus.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: larsi@gnus.org Original-X-From: sxemacs-devel-bounces@lists.sxemacs.org Wed Dec 30 15:33:45 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: gesd-sxemacs-devel-2@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from zapata.dreamhost.com ([66.33.216.56]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1aEHot-0001x1-4U for gesd-sxemacs-devel-2@m.gmane.org; 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X-Attribution: SY Mail-Followup-To: larsi@gnus.org, ding@gnus.org, sxemacs-devel@sxemacs.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org, yamaoka@jpl.org In-Reply-To: (sxemacs-devel-bounces@lists.sxemacs.org's message of "Wed, 30 Dec 2015 03:43:41 -0800") User-Agent: Gnus/5.130014 (Ma Gnus v0.14) SXEmacs/22.1.15 (Goggomobil, linux) X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.74 on 10.1.1.10 X-BeenThere: sxemacs-devel@lists.sxemacs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: SXEmacs developers' list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: sxemacs-devel-bounces@lists.sxemacs.org Original-Sender: "SXEmacs-Devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.sxemacs.devel:3566 gmane.emacs.gnus.general:86451 gmane.emacs.devel:197172 Archived-At: --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Lars Magne Ingebrigtsen writes: > (Excuse the crossposting.) No problem. Apologies for my list bouncing you. I've tweaked my mailman settings so subsequent messages shouldn't get discarded (fingers crossed) > Back in the olden days, there were basically two reasons for doing > the Gnus development outside of Emacs: 1) Emacs was releasing very > slowly, and Gnus very fast, and 2) XEmacs was an important target > for development. > 1) is not true any more. And XEmacs isn't as vital as it used to be. Yep, I'll certainly give you that. The advantage/benefits I see to having the Gnus code base reside outside of Emacs is that (S)XEmacs Gnus hackers don't need to have a copy of Emacs checked out just to hack Gnus. And I'm sure that there are plenty who'd like to hack/use dev Gnus from stable Emacs. > And the SXEmacs peeps just started maintaining their own Gnus repo, Wow, news gets around fast. :-) I gotta admit though that I wasn't planning on doing anything large scale with that. Just the odd tweaks to keep it build-able and run-able. (partially motivated by apparent stagnation in XEmacs packages) > which means that this might be a good opportunity to discontinue the > git.gnus.org repo and just continue development on the Emacs trunk > instead. > Emacs has developed rapidly during the last few years, and the > interfaces between Emacs, older versions of Emacs, and XEmacs are > growing more divergent. This means that basically any change we do in > Gnus fails to build on all build targets. And this, in turn, means that > any change we do in Gnus is 2x as much work as it should be, and this > leaves the code looking like an exercise in obfuscated programming. > Sometimes. :-) But this has nothing to do with _where_ the canonical source repo is, and everything to do with _which_ emacsen you want to support. > So: I want to know how all y'all would feel if I closed git.gnus.org and > started bringing the Gnus code base in the Emacs trunk up to modern > Emacs standards. I'd feel sad, but I guess I could live with it. I'm not sure how I could keep my Gnus repo tracking your development if your stuff isn't in its own repo, but I'll figure something out. > That would mean removing basically all compat code. OK, from where I sit, this would totally suck. :-( And anyone not wanting to use dev Emacs would just have to put it all back in. Any chance I could talk you out of it? Is there a compromise? Would it be possible/acceptable to leave in the existing compat code but not update it or use it for any new features from this point on? (I realise this wouldn't be possible every time) Or perhaps only remove the stuff that is currently proving to be trouble spots for you (analogous to "If it ain't broke, don't fix it")? I don't mind having to bring my own glue to get the lastest and greatest shiny new feature working, but I don't want to glue stuff that has been working fine for me for the last 15 to 20 years. =2D-=20 |---------------------| | SXEmacs - The only _______ you'll ever need. | | Fill in the blank, yes, it's THAT good! | |---------------------------------------| --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2 Comment: The SXEmacs Project Comment: EMchat - The SXEmacs IM client Comment: SYcom Comment: the Reading Lamp iEYEARECAAYFAlaD6zYACgkQHSfbS6lLMAPxGQCcClFe+LnPT+MMhuI7o5PuT2xQ 4i0An309pXNo50q4BBrZT3qaJchiJ9zy =HfCE -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=--