From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: joakim@verona.se Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Emacs as WM Date: Sat, 09 Aug 2014 00:49:15 +0200 Message-ID: References: NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1407538202 17445 80.91.229.3 (8 Aug 2014 22:50:02 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2014 22:50:02 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Emacs developers To: Matthew Plant Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Aug 09 00:49:56 2014 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1XFsyy-0000zT-0z for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 09 Aug 2014 00:49:56 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:53456 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1XFsyx-0005On-KZ for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 08 Aug 2014 18:49:55 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:51795) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1XFsyp-0005Ma-BA for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 08 Aug 2014 18:49:53 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1XFsyj-0002r6-1C for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 08 Aug 2014 18:49:47 -0400 Original-Received: from mx6.bahnhof.se ([213.80.101.16]:2695) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1XFsyi-0002ot-N4 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 08 Aug 2014 18:49:40 -0400 Original-Received: from localhost (mf.bahnhof.se [213.80.101.20]) by mx6-reinject (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2FA2F41838; Sat, 9 Aug 2014 00:49:38 +0200 (CEST) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new using ClamAV at bahnhof.se (MF3) Original-Received: from mf3.bahnhof.se ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mf3.bahnhof.se [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id PGUZoDmH6tBq; Sat, 9 Aug 2014 00:49:26 +0200 (CEST) Original-Received: from mta.verona.se (h-235-102.a149.priv.bahnhof.se [85.24.235.102]) by mf3.bahnhof.se (Postfix) with ESMTP id 291023E8CA8; Sat, 9 Aug 2014 00:49:25 +0200 (CEST) Original-Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by mta.verona.se (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC948585708; Fri, 8 Aug 2014 22:49:25 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at verona.se Original-Received: from mta.verona.se ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (exodia.verona.se [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id KHdgik0Rn3d0; Sat, 9 Aug 2014 00:49:15 +0200 (CEST) Original-Received: from exodia.verona.se (www.verona.se [192.168.200.15]) by mta.verona.se (Postfix) with ESMTP id 719BC585452; Sat, 9 Aug 2014 00:49:15 +0200 (CEST) In-Reply-To: (Matthew Plant's message of "Fri, 8 Aug 2014 13:35:42 -0700") User-Agent: Gnus/5.130012 (Ma Gnus v0.12) Emacs/24.4.50 (gnu/linux) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 213.80.101.16 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:173494 Archived-At: Matthew Plant writes: > I was curious about what people on this list thought about application > embedding in Emacs. To a degree this is already supported with ansi > term, but this obviously doesn't extend to GUI applications. For those > of you familiar with Plan 9, think of how programs use the window the > terminal they're launched in; embedding GUI apps in Emacs would force > the program to run in a window owned by Emacs and fitted into a buffer. Please see the Emacs Xwidget project, which has a somewhat rambling overview here: http://www.verona.se/thoughts/2013/10/24_xwidget-emacs.html > > The reason why I bring this up is because it would be relatively easy to > do in a way that's not very platform agnostic. It's really easy to > replace the X libarary (forgive me for not using proper nomenclature; > it'd lengthen this email tenfold) window creation functions with one > that extends contol over the window. The degree of integration can be > controlled by the number of replaced functions. If drawn text wants to > be handled specially, those functions would be replaced. Some method can > be specified for switching between emacs and the application controlling > user input. > > This has some obvious advantages; for one, Emacs automatically subsumes > all editors, including more WYSIWYG editors. Not only that, but Emacs > essentially becomes a window manager, which I personally would > love. Because some apps, particular web browsers, do not always require > special handling of the keyboard, switching between regular Emacs > buffers and the special app buffers would be generally seamless. I could > imagine myself typing away in one Emacs buffer, momentarily moving to > the mouse to click throught some online doxygen in my web browser in the > buffer to the right. > > There are also a lot of disadvantages to this. For one, the applications > would be pretty buggy without some effort to re-implement X > functions. Also, my co-worker points out that this would be incongrous > with the current capabilities of Emacs, one of which is the easy > transfer of text betwixt buffers. Getting these two features to work > harmoniously would be kind of difficult; lots of wrappers to > X/Gnome/whatever text writing functions would have to be made. However, > copy and paste would work (I'm guessing) out of the box. > > I suppose it all boils down to what people want with the future of > Emacs. Personally, I would love to turn on my computer and have Emacs be > there every step of the way. I genuinely think that Emacs is a great > full interface to an OS. It is not a full OS however and never should > be, which is why I like this idea as an in-between. > > -M > -- Joakim Verona