From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Lars Ingebrigtsen Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: libnettle/libhogweed WIP Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2017 17:59:51 +0200 Message-ID: References: <83y3w5z1ez.fsf@gnu.org> <87lgr6yakj.fsf@lifelogs.com> <87wpamww9k.fsf@lifelogs.com> <8337daggnj.fsf@gnu.org> <87d1cdwxt6.fsf@lifelogs.com> <83tw5pg1q3.fsf@gnu.org> <87zifhulc2.fsf@lifelogs.com> <83h91og80k.fsf@gnu.org> <87pogbuhoe.fsf@lifelogs.com> <834lxndmd9.fsf@gnu.org> <87efwrug6z.fsf@lifelogs.com> <83bmrscvdb.fsf@gnu.org> <871ssos8jp.fsf@lifelogs.com> <83y3uwb995.fsf@gnu.org> <83wpafbyk6.fsf@gnu.org> <83o9vraxow.fsf@gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1492704242 18801 195.159.176.226 (20 Apr 2017 16:04:02 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2017 16:04:02 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/26.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: Stefan Monnier , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Apr 20 18:03:55 2017 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1d1EYi-0004fa-Mw for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 20 Apr 2017 18:03:52 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:54772 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1d1EYm-00042J-Jw for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 20 Apr 2017 12:03:56 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:58695) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1d1EV8-00022Z-Iz for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 20 Apr 2017 12:00:11 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1d1EV4-0001tX-Ip for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 20 Apr 2017 12:00:10 -0400 Original-Received: from hermes.netfonds.no ([80.91.224.195]:41818) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1d1EV4-0001oj-D7; Thu, 20 Apr 2017 12:00:06 -0400 Original-Received: from cm-84.213.17.174.getinternet.no ([84.213.17.174] helo=stories) by hermes.netfonds.no with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1d1EUp-0004xg-Io; Thu, 20 Apr 2017 17:59:55 +0200 Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAAFVBMVEXXtJErGxkKBAVnRDvB mHSmdFn38upvJ4P2AAACd0lEQVQ4jXWUwXLbOAyGMQ3F81KqHkD25B4W4p27Bn2WQjJndtfm+z9C f8jbNOnswp6RrY8AfgIgqf+PUZNIJL9b7HTPueaJfZj5NX9zz57P/I250z/7RfLMOeCTX3n2lXkP Cpx3blmc83iOTm10i1PgxpOavlrG8bTo30XB6WETH8vd+R08PJaJ2eHrz+4dHOjMgZn95N9D+SOA ggBBzA9/AHXXvLWGUjOHD0DNjVhf6748tCgIFZbZzZVL2v+VqGCuB/FngPr6CRQpUrOrIX0CU0E1 jVS/hlR+ByYaVDJL+ZhjqugIepLCXuQy/gKnUIgMmcr7+hF8P2mXyMjF+6+fwZldKBIvu1sl+w+h Jo80QkPiInl/tCZodZnVAcK2kNa/jtYUUVWsgiGsXdbEXw7gC6aE/YwdsqXBl7R+P0JNLwDpFeBy erGJJb21AzBA72YV8c9k6yTF9qcFmnhT0IqkKQ6UucRrJ49BCQe4F7G9UnyqQkL0hFatFeAOsbbV RNa2re6ToOt/XAD+RorrLQ3wvRV202zyuGKo+9OzyNZNIkI2DN0U+42QqzWPSqxE1lhDqNUc+73C o/UhSx1nijdUP28SyN5LUWDi18uZr7010R0GiferlmSz/U9m6mSxZIi3QmWwNwDsthukwma0kzfb h2QbQN1wEg3d5Q0AFHuq165n8Cod3Wjlao1R90YV4akNbbDIDK/STO/YQaxvepwbDd1imYkVGJox MFYBtWQVDBShuOpURr0AEFNe8MM2rYk1tcTHzYD3KBUANCFCT5r/4YGqEyLamAq8hq399NhMj2KM DFWX/ArVLT3um2Y0Idn+E/y3/QAehAC97wRF8wAAAABJRU5ErkJggg== In-Reply-To: <83o9vraxow.fsf@gnu.org> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Thu, 20 Apr 2017 18:46:55 +0300") X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] [fuzzy] X-Received-From: 80.91.224.195 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:214148 Archived-At: Eli Zaretskii writes: >> > How is this different from write-region and its ilks? >> >> Off the top of my head: >> - it's new, so we get to avoid past errors > > Not sure what past errors you had in mind. Any errors we made in the > encoding/decoding department were fixed by Emacs 23, and the stuff is > remarkably stable since then, with a single minor improvement in Emacs > 24.4. From my POV, this one of the greatest success stories in Emacs. > Paid for with sweat, blood, and tears, but success nonetheless. Why > would we want to refrain from reusing it? These are encryption primitives. Stuffing code that guesses What I Mean into these primitives doesn't seem like the most productive way to proceed. If somebody later wants to add a DWIM framework on top of these primitives (to, say, automatically encrypt everything that Emacs saves), that's a different thing. But the primitives themselves should, in my opinion, be functional and predictable: You give them explicit inputs and you always get the same result back. Encryption is also often used in conjunction with various protocols, and (as opposed to saving files locally) the local user's preferences are irrelevant to how the octets are supposed to be encoded on the wire. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no