From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Andy Wingo Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Save `nil' from the mutant void, preserve the truth of falsehood, prevent the falsehood of truth Date: Sun, 12 Sep 2010 13:04:14 +0200 Message-ID: References: NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1284289280 20062 80.91.229.12 (12 Sep 2010 11:01:20 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 12 Sep 2010 11:01:20 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: MON KEY Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sun Sep 12 13:01:19 2010 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OukJ8-0003Jj-NF for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 12 Sep 2010 13:01:18 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:59596 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1OukJ5-0006W4-IU for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 12 Sep 2010 07:01:11 -0400 Original-Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=39947 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1OukIy-0006VN-3C for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 12 Sep 2010 07:01:05 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OukIv-0006OY-HK for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 12 Sep 2010 07:01:03 -0400 Original-Received: from a-pb-sasl-quonix.pobox.com ([208.72.237.25]:58296 helo=sasl.smtp.pobox.com) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OukIv-0006OJ-Bh for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 12 Sep 2010 07:01:01 -0400 Original-Received: from sasl.smtp.pobox.com (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by a-pb-sasl-quonix.pobox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B83D9D5078; Sun, 12 Sep 2010 07:01:00 -0400 (EDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed; d=pobox.com; h=from:to:cc :subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version :content-type; s=sasl; bh=boEl+eR/eXguyEH9Dh8+xd4plro=; b=G5s8rY sMsjb/ZDv41aogcRy0GjJS9+gEJQu30b0kLGi3Gss0VgSfxKD7L36M8eS6+10BlL VYIlsA5HuyDDpphh1cKSozTRgNohlxSXY+GcK9B238QfW7F5d23Yg/5tRhBkEgAK Sy8MNZ15TygJpDFNqDECuyIUGCNT1afDIO8FI= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=pobox.com; h=from:to:cc :subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version :content-type; q=dns; s=sasl; b=w0cmaN5TwaKFRFMntYdUsSjeukBTRLZH zaQfpl2d1RKxEB+UkTz1vGfDm5T08Q8B5D2dlvDIDBj9BLwqSbaHr4gcyJameBdf dCm8Gkzfxw/aUK1pAsM+uwxXc/BpGPEoK5pBteiHQUtFXzfla+6DpGR5Gauh1Q8d DmMuAQ3alf0= Original-Received: from a-pb-sasl-quonix. (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by a-pb-sasl-quonix.pobox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A4815D5077; Sun, 12 Sep 2010 07:00:59 -0400 (EDT) Original-Received: from unquote.localdomain (unknown [83.44.190.100]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by a-pb-sasl-quonix.pobox.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id E60D9D5074; Sun, 12 Sep 2010 07:00:57 -0400 (EDT) In-Reply-To: (MON KEY's message of "Sat, 11 Sep 2010 19:33:07 -0400") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.2 (gnu/linux) X-Pobox-Relay-ID: 069AA62A-BE5D-11DF-8B5A-030CEE7EF46B-02397024!a-pb-sasl-quonix.pobox.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Solaris 10 (beta) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:130009 Archived-At: Hello, On Sun 12 Sep 2010 01:33, MON KEY writes: > So, how do the Schemes handle this? Is it possible to define/set away > #f? In Scheme, #f and '() are not identifiers (symbols), so it is impossible to set! them. > This said, Guile 1.9.10 doesn't seem to mind me let-binding `nil': > > scheme@(guile-user)> (let ((nil 'bubba)) nil) > ;=> bubba Nil does not exist in Scheme, so it is not bound. However Guile does provide a separate nil value, which may be read as "#nil" -- again, not an identifier. (There is also a %nil symbol bound to #nil in the default environment with deprecated symbols enabled, but that is a relic.) There are still some nil-is-a-symbol-in-elisp issues to work out in Guile. In fact there are still a number of symbols-are-fat-in-elisp, symbols-are-just-immutable-strings-in-scheme issues to work out... I don't think my comments have much bearing on your original comment, though :) Andy -- http://wingolog.org/