From mboxrd@z Thu Jan  1 00:00:00 1970
Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail
From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel
Subject: Re: How to make Emacs popular again.
Date: Thu, 08 Oct 2020 17:00:29 +0200
Message-ID: <m2y2kg69v6.fsf@gmail.com>
References: <CANQHGB1052fKdSq0=F-PG8hLMC3WX-R3UaMmrHrntG8J3J2pVw@mail.gmail.com>
 <20200926163008.GS1349@protected.rcdrun.com>
 <s6jzh5bceim.fsf@emailmessageidheader.nil>
 <alpine.NEB.2.22.394.2010070904200453.21988@sdf.lonestar.org>
 <CALDnm50iSGedcCrHdTKgA9TRs1Zow83n4jxy31h3iv45uSfz6g@mail.gmail.com>
 <E1kQNlW-0005wE-0p@fencepost.gnu.org>
 <alpine.NEB.2.22.394.2010081607490453.9426@sdf.lonestar.org>
 <m2362o7puh.fsf@gmail.com>
 <alpine.NEB.2.22.394.2010081645300453.12654@sdf.lonestar.org>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214";
	logging-data="9867"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io"
Cc: bobnewell@bobnewell.net,
 =?utf-8?B?Sm8=?= =?utf-8?B?w6NvIFTDoXZvcmE=?= <joaotavora@gmail.com>,
 Richard Stallman <rms@gnu.org>, emacs-devel@gnu.org
To: Gregory Heytings <ghe@sdf.org>
Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Oct 08 17:02:16 2020
Return-path: <emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org>
Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org
Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17])
	by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
	(Exim 4.92)
	(envelope-from <emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org>)
	id 1kQXQt-0002S8-5i
	for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 08 Oct 2020 17:02:15 +0200
Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:39618 helo=lists1p.gnu.org)
	by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1)
	(envelope-from <emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org>)
	id 1kQXQs-00040F-3Z
	for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 08 Oct 2020 11:02:14 -0400
Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:45792)
 by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <rpluim@gmail.com>) id 1kQXPI-00033V-DO
 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 08 Oct 2020 11:00:36 -0400
Original-Received: from mail-wm1-x329.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::329]:36654)
 by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128)
 (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <rpluim@gmail.com>)
 id 1kQXPF-0002Gr-Pv; Thu, 08 Oct 2020 11:00:36 -0400
Original-Received: by mail-wm1-x329.google.com with SMTP id e2so6857049wme.1;
 Thu, 08 Oct 2020 08:00:33 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025;
 h=from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id
 :mime-version; bh=irzVb1Vy/Ax0ZYAweZ5+1tUK6bgC64VC5IfZzgi0pGw=;
 b=JHxuoHtgxsB8MElNW4vHx30+GUqPZn2xWY3hklfO6A795MWpzoLfJ+hbTHX2KYf8sN
 j1Y5MxS/xNxVkhVwiIJq7NyCT2mwkx8NPdzwGHzrrfCmvmLwtTN4dZNH0eOtfFDGZVki
 FjZZLWz4DBKQuw21U/7ji456E8CbHN+26XCJ8AvLlZ67njoVWi3dCbRBjWwB21AgcVEL
 nu7eJFxpafzTqmkoW0x4MCWbocpML+PqdErGX+Lx12kPu/uMjSdii5Id06qpeoydMRIA
 223OC1XNuUgjbPiuj5AEuum7NgaXkvDvtiakki8tNUQgBYjOtES6vPGvXdeVDTHoMiDh
 bQ3w==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=1e100.net; s=20161025;
 h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to
 :message-id:mime-version;
 bh=irzVb1Vy/Ax0ZYAweZ5+1tUK6bgC64VC5IfZzgi0pGw=;
 b=Ck96viJwgWGBnchKuALa0Xnd4dROQJehARLlbUuaHWjiVLAWn9JsqN2zP/1ay4M/WE
 Y25Pd5yHTDr/7V16ZpLOFXMkccB7KnK5XQFSJISKpPOYUMQBOdPQaCK5HDpAVLwXxyT9
 rHpIuGDky9tY8MAUL4iLlL4M4xk91mBC8Nv9OeGg3hjvfGWHb4zOi3yFzsBaTYfPm7yT
 XaqxGUMqgAseCfa1KNF/ub/VMJMULMRNeqITTwgVEwovF1mkPfAG5jSHid+mafm7JgsY
 aerbQ6lPCcOV2rlXtewpWmojB1/Gjb1MxtxRoWlUHI9KgqmZvBvDDdfptQEjXpH1MUA0
 jdig==
X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530vSxCLsUr3yEdF/qQas4hPXpSmYRzfBjUXwWmkBSYyNThThuIO
 9cVNu800QBtrhHINXmVsPes=
X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwck3tNU6bjxDpzBnSer4gkej9mDT4cJapYjCGXuMnfDQhCJzEIX10rVIBIK0IE8dFWKHgodw==
X-Received: by 2002:a1c:7c12:: with SMTP id x18mr9528991wmc.107.1602169231623; 
 Thu, 08 Oct 2020 08:00:31 -0700 (PDT)
Original-Received: from rpluim-mac ([2a01:e34:ecfc:a860:683b:48ba:13fe:a576])
 by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id v83sm6967178wmb.22.2020.10.08.08.00.30
 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256);
 Thu, 08 Oct 2020 08:00:30 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <alpine.NEB.2.22.394.2010081645300453.12654@sdf.lonestar.org>
 (Gregory Heytings's message of "Thu, 08 Oct 2020 14:54:09 +0000")
Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::329;
 envelope-from=rpluim@gmail.com; helo=mail-wm1-x329.google.com
X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: No matching host in p0f cache.
 That's all we know.
X-Spam_score_int: -20
X-Spam_score: -2.1
X-Spam_bar: --
X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1,
 DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001,
 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001,
 SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
X-Spam_action: no action
X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23
Precedence: list
List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." <emacs-devel.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/options/emacs-devel>,
 <mailto:emacs-devel-request@gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel>
List-Post: <mailto:emacs-devel@gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:emacs-devel-request@gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/emacs-devel>,
 <mailto:emacs-devel-request@gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org
Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel"
 <emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org>
Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:257211
Archived-At: <http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel/257211>

>>>>> On Thu, 08 Oct 2020 14:54:09 +0000, Gregory Heytings <ghe@sdf.org> said:

    Gregory> Well, that doesn't quite do what I suggest.  It only finds the symbol
    Gregory> in the Emacs manual (AFAICS it does not search in the Elisp manual),
    Gregory> and what you find when you do this on a command is something that much
    Gregory> resembles what you find in the docstring, so it doesn't look like
    Gregory> useful information, it looks redundant.  As I said, I think entering
    Gregory> the chapter would be much more useful, as it would give the user the
    Gregory> feeling that there is more information there.

It puts you in info, where it is obvious there is more information: at
the top of the buffer it says:

Up: Deletion and Killing

so finding out more is easy.

Robert
--