From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: John Wiegley Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: naming functions [was: Ibuffer: w and B default to buffer at current line] Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2016 12:23:33 -0700 Message-ID: References: >>>> <83intw5our.fsf@gnu.org>> <3dbc0c03-56f9-4b6f-bd3b-258458967665@default> >>> <83zin630i9.fsf@gnu.org>> <024f1fd0-80ee-4780-bebb-c935959851bc@default>> <83vaxuib1p.fsf@gnu.org>>> > <83poo1i8nf.fsf@gnu.org>> <054178e6-00ee-48ec-8799-3845c79675cd@default> NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="=-=-="; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature" X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1474230761 11351 195.159.176.226 (18 Sep 2016 20:32:41 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2016 20:32:41 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: Gnus/5.130014 (Ma Gnus v0.14) Emacs/25.1 (darwin) Cc: Eli Zaretskii , emacs-devel@gnu.org, tino.calancha@gmail.com To: Drew Adams Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sun Sep 18 22:32:37 2016 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1blilQ-0002Ou-97 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 18 Sep 2016 22:32:36 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:51355 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1blilO-0007pR-EC for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 18 Sep 2016 16:32:34 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:54146) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1blilD-0007nd-2i for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 18 Sep 2016 16:32:24 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1blilB-00012j-0o for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 18 Sep 2016 16:32:22 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-pf0-f182.google.com ([209.85.192.182]:34072) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1blil5-0000yn-B2; Sun, 18 Sep 2016 16:32:15 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-pf0-f182.google.com with SMTP id p64so43538683pfb.1; Sun, 18 Sep 2016 13:32:14 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:date:message-id:references :user-agent:mail-followup-to:mime-version; bh=LXKom1kO2C0MMfxIsI2hl6+tLngZfyA1sFD5y7dJN8w=; b=bcDlstPnUMqwgffHbQ7PmmPyrXiMyOkpjO1RXqn3dFCT67wUWF1R9UCweI4vHMAHEu wLZpdaqYNyBzxNpELBvCH2IQn5p/1phe9jPzCPiHLGE76rd5TSFjtZw+aODRvE32v1yX q/bHsNDd4VmCECYd2TPxft1kwMBFAd71DR+YUvbMVV+uGZ2blwZGC3qY+T2MQLQifu/J mIoUHXcU6Yg0JV8yScePo+gSCsGldxlESVQx8ah6uaRrCoKykNEhyTUKKMgAkpWa3Hpo eB3WTg/wTk4EDBKUb/T6+YHmLPrMMMQ6VTji3rhOt4kggr6yDpnkDB6rEBL0r9UOfQyP 622w== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:date:message-id :references:user-agent:mail-followup-to:mime-version; bh=LXKom1kO2C0MMfxIsI2hl6+tLngZfyA1sFD5y7dJN8w=; b=EpfA537p8YakWTBIFnpAQL3fXH1rxdhX+te8Wx+fXnejc7JHeJhuzT4fWMZOfj+Z/R 8rhUCVzdArH3gXVZWiThiXhtdR6zftK2Rj+YX5zHrvFEaCG/M5PxVXPd6hGdCw0/7ziW ZZ9b2QNSgoOLNu4IrEfX/1VLDLY+0Lg4PUCCZfVwFp9qZk/Ka7TKWjoXfPOmHPb4Ds+9 lhz5FKjGGqPo0RAFpxxswtTxVIPBd1/8ZFS4sxW0URXVUHJWnYfAG+nwM/YmMpTPjAok 7sC0p3mFB+pBPtHPPxWYJoIuUE8FCKBLmcdjcthYzBgmZ3RF2th38sCz9XZ277z8hDfC V9PA== X-Gm-Message-State: AE9vXwMDW6TX5jYWsdwRXX7vMY8rK4fC4zLRJ8CEXrUdFAL2C7nmRRu3kaKqfGQwOrL49w== X-Received: by 10.98.157.83 with SMTP id i80mr18120029pfd.162.1474226696499; Sun, 18 Sep 2016 12:24:56 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from Vulcan.local (76-234-69-149.lightspeed.frokca.sbcglobal.net. [76.234.69.149]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id r77sm14149276pfg.16.2016.09.18.12.24.55 (version=TLS1 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128/128); Sun, 18 Sep 2016 12:24:55 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-Original-From: "John Wiegley" Original-Received: by Vulcan.local (Postfix, from userid 501) id 0C58B262265D; Sun, 18 Sep 2016 12:24:54 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <054178e6-00ee-48ec-8799-3845c79675cd@default> (Drew Adams's message of "Sun, 18 Sep 2016 10:55:30 -0700 (PDT)") Mail-Followup-To: Drew Adams , Eli Zaretskii , tino.calancha@gmail.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] [fuzzy] X-Received-From: 209.85.192.182 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:207583 Archived-At: --=-=-= Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >>>>> Drew Adams writes: > Is `forward-char' a bad name, because with a negative prefix arg it moves > backward? Is it a bad name because it is singular and a prefix arg > 1 mo= ves > further than one position? > Should the name have been `move-char' or `move-chars'? If so, then what > about binding forward and backward default behaviors to different keys, > `C-f' and `C-b'? > I think (hope) you get the point. A function name only goes so far toward > indicating what the function does. If a prefix arg to a command chooses > alternative behavior, then it would often be cumbersome and _less_ clear = to > users, to use a name that tries to summarize all of the behaviors. The only point I'm seeing here is that we've been imprecise with our functi= on names in the past. That is not a valid argument for how we should assess patches in the future. Yes, `forward-char' is misleading. `move-point' might have been a better choice. But there are many ships like this that left the port long ago. I'm not even suggesting we retroactively fix any of them. What I will do, howev= er, is reject the belief that because it happened in the past, this makes it OK= to extend existing functions like this for the sake of expediency. So unless you're actually arguing for it to be OK to extend functions beyond their stated semantics, I hope we can agree on the essential point here: do= n't pollute the behavior of functions because it's easy to do so. With just a b= it of extra work, we can avoid unnecessarily increasing our technical debt. =2D-=20 John Wiegley GPG fingerprint =3D 4710 CF98 AF9B 327B B80F http://newartisans.com 60E1 46C4 BD1A 7AC1 4BA2 --=-=-= Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQGcBAEBCgAGBQJX3um2AAoJEMFE2PTxn+YwxB0MAJgZwIafS8atguSpB/jJRC/S pGC1v79Osz6BkdJlF35Ipeb1j4KXcSQFNgxHXWAIvJUoBAL0xYRfZZ4D6sM1OP8p zYZj7HagvpSbEf0SJ7jE3sLBM6oikv643Cvz+yxYVunKxOmdX/NitPS7kLAkS7Tt Kf364R9+/8wZ/Jq4NE5Wm+hRmydzMV7X0AH7nqFXHhdHhVhpd/HI4bqIkrb5grrJ pKUgNq5XgTwZHr9LqzDNdX3D0J1WNK/haypzNku7/xESlxXe/zxtCZzU2pjjJZbp 9XyJzAC/QBO+1iP/Ohcwzz+lrNa3vpuEZ4CfV0OWTCxvM8ShqP+NYDevkF1yDFod l+ysqg4S6V/F8FnuWNQhzcu5laxc6o//foF19F7L+jbyMJ9V/Nrj/voTy34FzhPQ IElKYKCOAE/kVLkj6GMfeYTLxTsDZpnu/1LTxgqcdSYZaCvPXzO/wrAFvb3cURt2 2tJsIpF12+poIsM8PMyJeJucDVeMj4Q10DK844Fg5A== =AqtB -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-=-=--