Problem with the RETURN key

Problem with the RETURN key

[Ovidiu Predescu]

Hi,

With the latest CVS I get a really weird problem on MacOS X. The return 
key does not seem to work anymore on my TiBook 800MHz. The only way I 
can make it to work is if I press the Function key on the keyboard. 
When I hook up a USB keyboard to the laptop, the return key on this is 
still not functional, but the return key on the keypad works just fine.

I looked at the source code but I couldn't spot anything suspicious. 
The only thing which might provoke this behavior is the uControl 
ControlPanel plugin I have installed on my machine. But I disabled the 
plugin and I still notice this behavior.

Does anybody else see this problem?

Best regards,
-- 
Ovidiu Predescu <ovidiu@apache.org>
http://webweavertech.com/ovidiu/weblog/

Re: Problem with the RETURN key

[Andrew Choi]

Ovidiu Predescu <ovidiu@apache.org> writes:

> With the latest CVS I get a really weird problem on MacOS X. The
> return key does not seem to work anymore on my TiBook 800MHz. The only
> way I can make it to work is if I press the Function key on the
> keyboard. When I hook up a USB keyboard to the laptop, the return key
> on this is still not functional, but the return key on the keypad
> works just fine.  [...]

I don't have access to a TiBook so I cannot check this.  Please check
whether RET is recognized at all by Emacs.  I.e., what does

  (read-event)

evaluate to when you hit the return key?  The most recent change to key
handle I can think of is the following.

2002-10-04  Steven Tamm  <steventamm@mac.com>

	* macterm.c (keycode_to_xkeysym_table): Change return to be
	treated like an X keysym.

But it was done quite a while ago.  But you should probably start
looking there.

Re: Problem with the RETURN key

[Ovidiu Predescu]

Hi Andrew,

Thanks a lot for the quick reply!

On Monday, Dec 16, 2002, at 12:17 US/Pacific, Andrew Choi wrote:

> Ovidiu Predescu <ovidiu@apache.org> writes:
>
>> With the latest CVS I get a really weird problem on MacOS X. The
>> return key does not seem to work anymore on my TiBook 800MHz. The only
>> way I can make it to work is if I press the Function key on the
>> keyboard. When I hook up a USB keyboard to the laptop, the return key
>> on this is still not functional, but the return key on the keypad
>> works just fine.  [...]
>
> I don't have access to a TiBook so I cannot check this.  Please check
> whether RET is recognized at all by Emacs.  I.e., what does
>
>   (read-event)
>
> evaluate to when you hit the return key?  The most recent change to key
> handle I can think of is the following.

This is indeed interesting. Here are the results of running 
(read-event):

- external keyboard:
     keypad return key: 'kp-enter'
     normal return key: 'return'

- built-in keyboard:
     return key with "function" button pressed: 'kp-enter'
     normal return key: 'return'

'kp-enter' is bound to 'newline', but 'return' is bound to nothing, 
which is why it doesn't work. To alleviate the problem I defined:

(global-set-key [return] 'newline)

in my .emacs. But it would be good to have this work with the stock 
Emacs.

> 2002-10-04  Steven Tamm  <steventamm@mac.com>
>
> 	* macterm.c (keycode_to_xkeysym_table): Change return to be
> 	treated like an X keysym.
>
> But it was done quite a while ago.  But you should probably start
> looking there.

Up until very recently I've been using CVS sources extracted from on 
September 27. This problem started affecting me only in the past few 
days.

Regards,
-- 
Ovidiu Predescu <ovidiu@apache.org>
http://webweavertech.com/ovidiu/weblog/

Re: Problem with the RETURN key

[Ovidiu Predescu]

On Monday, Dec 16, 2002, at 16:50 US/Pacific, Ovidiu Predescu wrote:

> To alleviate the problem I defined:
>
> (global-set-key [return] 'newline)
>
> in my .emacs. But it would be good to have this work with the stock 
> Emacs.
>
>> 2002-10-04  Steven Tamm  <steventamm@mac.com>
>>
>> 	* macterm.c (keycode_to_xkeysym_table): Change return to be
>> 	treated like an X keysym.
>>
>> But it was done quite a while ago.  But you should probably start
>> looking there.
>
> Up until very recently I've been using CVS sources extracted from on 
> September 27. This problem started affecting me only in the past few 
> days.

I was wrong, my solution worked in limited cases only. Replacing in the 
keycode_to_xkeysym_table array the '\x0d' with 0 solved the problem for 
me.

Steven, could you provide a quick explanation why the change was needed 
in the first place?

Regards,
-- 
Ovidiu Predescu <ovidiu@apache.org>
http://webweavertech.com/ovidiu/weblog/

Re: Problem with the RETURN key

[Andrew Choi]

Ovidiu Predescu <ovidiu@apache.org> writes:

> [...]  Here are the results of running (read-event):
> 
> - external keyboard:
>      keypad return key: 'kp-enter'
>      normal return key: 'return'
                           ^^^^^^
> - built-in keyboard:
>      return key with "function" button pressed: 'kp-enter'
>      normal return key: 'return'
                           ^^^^^^

Then there is no problem with the C code recognizing the return key on
the Powerbook G4.  What does `C-h k RET' say?  Mine says:

  RET (translated from <return>) runs the command newline
  ...

Can you try running without a start-up file?

> I was wrong, my solution worked in limited cases only. Replacing in
> the keycode_to_xkeysym_table array the '\x0d' with 0 solved the
> problem for me.

Please don't change the code arbitrarily without understanding it.  It
is there to make Emacs recognize C-return, among other things.

Re: Problem with the RETURN key

[Ovidiu Predescu]

On Monday, Dec 16, 2002, at 18:12 US/Pacific, Andrew Choi wrote:

> Ovidiu Predescu <ovidiu@apache.org> writes:
>
>> [...]  Here are the results of running (read-event):
>>
>> - external keyboard:
>>      keypad return key: 'kp-enter'
>>      normal return key: 'return'
>                            ^^^^^^
>> - built-in keyboard:
>>      return key with "function" button pressed: 'kp-enter'
>>      normal return key: 'return'
>                            ^^^^^^
>
> Then there is no problem with the C code recognizing the return key on
> the Powerbook G4.  What does `C-h k RET' say?  Mine says:
>
>   RET (translated from <return>) runs the command newline
>   ...
>
> Can you try running without a start-up file?

The result is "<return> is undefined". This happens with no startup 
file.

>> I was wrong, my solution worked in limited cases only. Replacing in
>> the keycode_to_xkeysym_table array the '\x0d' with 0 solved the
>> problem for me.
>
> Please don't change the code arbitrarily without understanding it.  It
> is there to make Emacs recognize C-return, among other things.

I just wanted to verify this is the cause of the problem, and it seems 
to be indeed.

Any ideas on how to proceed further?

Best regards,
-- 
Ovidiu Predescu <ovidiu@apache.org>
http://webweavertech.com/ovidiu/weblog/

Re: Problem with the RETURN key

[Andrew Choi]

Ovidiu Predescu <ovidiu@apache.org> writes:

> The result is "<return> is undefined". This happens with no startup
> file.  [...]
> 
> Any ideas on how to proceed further?

Please read the node `Translating Input' in the Elisp manual.

What is the value of `function-key-map'?  Mine says:

  (keymap (M-return . [-134217715]) (return . [13]) (kp-equal . [61]) (kp-divide . [47]) (kp-decimal . [46]) (kp-subtract . [45]) (kp-separator . [44]) (kp-add . [43]) (kp-multiply . [42]) (kp-enter . [13]) (kp-tab . [9]) ...)

Note the entry for `return'.  If it is not there, you can say something
like

  (define-key function-key-map [return] [13])

but this really shouldn't be necessary.  Are you sure you have a correct
installation?  Is the problem really specific to the Powerbook G4?

Re: Problem with the RETURN key

[Ovidiu Predescu]

Hi Andrew,

On Tuesday, Dec 17, 2002, at 00:48 US/Pacific, Andrew Choi wrote:

> Ovidiu Predescu <ovidiu@apache.org> writes:
>
>> The result is "<return> is undefined". This happens with no startup
>> file.  [...]
>>
>> Any ideas on how to proceed further?
>
> Please read the node `Translating Input' in the Elisp manual.
>
> What is the value of `function-key-map'?  Mine says:
>
>   (keymap (M-return . [-134217715]) (return . [13]) (kp-equal . [61]) 
> (kp-divide . [47]) (kp-decimal . [46]) (kp-subtract . [45]) 
> (kp-separator . [44]) (kp-add . [43]) (kp-multiply . [42]) (kp-enter . 
> [13]) (kp-tab . [9]) ...)
>
> Note the entry for `return'.  If it is not there, you can say something
> like
>
>   (define-key function-key-map [return] [13])
>
> but this really shouldn't be necessary.

The value of function-key-map is

(keymap (kp-equal . [61]) (kp-divide . [47]) (kp-decimal . [46]) 
(kp-subtract . [45]) (kp-separator . [44]) (kp-add . [43]) (kp-multiply 
. [42]) (kp-enter . [13]) (kp-tab . [9]) (kp-space . [32]) (kp-9 . 
[57]) ...)

Adding the define-key does solve the problem, everything starts working 
normally.

> Are you sure you have a correct installation?

I have a system which I upgraded from 10.1 to 10.2, then 10.2.1 and 
10.2.2 with all the successive patches from Apple.

> Is the problem really specific to the Powerbook G4?

I don't know. The only MacOS X machine I have is this laptop, 
everything else are Linux boxes.

Thanks for the tips!

Best regards,
Ovidiu

Re: Problem with the RETURN key

[Brad Miller]

I've had this same problem with the return key ever since I first tried 
to rebuild after going to 10.2.2
I think I mentioned it here at the time.
My setup is an 800MHz G4 tower.  I have a non-apple natural keyboard, 
so I thought maybe it had something to do with the driver for that.  
I'm glad someone else has now found the same problem.

return is not defined in my function-key-map.
Adding the line:
> (define-key function-key-map [return] [13])
seems to work.

Brad


>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 01:48:06 -0700
> From: Andrew Choi <akochoi@shaw.ca>
> To: Ovidiu Predescu <ovidiu@apache.org>
> Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org
> Cc: Steven Tamm <steventamm@mac.com>
> Subject: Re: Problem with the RETURN key
> Message-ID: <m2n0n5c9q1.fsf@owlbear.local>
> In-Reply-To: <453EDB86-118F-11D7-B29E-00039398D61E@apache.org>
> References: <453EDB86-118F-11D7-B29E-00039398D61E@apache.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT
> Precedence: list
> Message: 2
>
> Ovidiu Predescu <ovidiu@apache.org> writes:
>
>> The result is "<return> is undefined". This happens with no startup
>> file.  [...]
>>
>> Any ideas on how to proceed further?
>
> Please read the node `Translating Input' in the Elisp manual.
>
> What is the value of `function-key-map'?  Mine says:
>
>   (keymap (M-return . [-134217715]) (return . [13]) (kp-equal . [61]) 
> (kp-divide . [47]) (kp-decimal . [46]) (kp-subtract . [45]) 
> (kp-separator . [44]) (kp-add . [43]) (kp-multiply . [42]) (kp-enter . 
> [13]) (kp-tab . [9]) ...)
>
> Note the entry for `return'.  If it is not there, you can say something
> like
>
>   (define-key function-key-map [return] [13])
>
> but this really shouldn't be necessary.  Are you sure you have a 
> correct
> installation?  Is the problem really specific to the Powerbook G4?
>
>
Brad Miller
PhD Candidate
University of Minnesota
(612) 384-8351
http://www-users.cs.umn.edu/~bmiller

Re: Problem with the RETURN key

[Andreas Schwab]

Brad Miller <bmiller@cs.umn.edu> writes:

|> I've had this same problem with the return key ever since I first tried to
|> rebuild after going to 10.2.2
|> I think I mentioned it here at the time.
|> My setup is an 800MHz G4 tower.  I have a non-apple natural keyboard, so I
|> thought maybe it had something to do with the driver for that.  I'm glad
|> someone else has now found the same problem.
|> 
|> return is not defined in my function-key-map.

What's your window-system?

Andreas.

-- 
Andreas Schwab, SuSE Labs, schwab@suse.de
SuSE Linux AG, Deutschherrnstr. 15-19, D-90429 Nürnberg
Key fingerprint = 58CA 54C7 6D53 942B 1756  01D3 44D5 214B 8276 4ED5
"And now for something completely different."

Re: Problem with the RETURN key

[Brad Miller]

My window-system is mac

Brad
On Tuesday, December 17, 2002, at 08:42 AM, Andreas Schwab wrote:

> Brad Miller <bmiller@cs.umn.edu> writes:
>
> |> I've had this same problem with the return key ever since I first 
> tried to
> |> rebuild after going to 10.2.2
> |> I think I mentioned it here at the time.
> |> My setup is an 800MHz G4 tower.  I have a non-apple natural 
> keyboard, so I
> |> thought maybe it had something to do with the driver for that.  I'm 
> glad
> |> someone else has now found the same problem.
> |>
> |> return is not defined in my function-key-map.
>
> What's your window-system?
>
> Andreas.
>
> -- 
> Andreas Schwab, SuSE Labs, schwab@suse.de
> SuSE Linux AG, Deutschherrnstr. 15-19, D-90429 Nürnberg
> Key fingerprint = 58CA 54C7 6D53 942B 1756  01D3 44D5 214B 8276 4ED5
> "And now for something completely different."
>
Brad Miller
PhD Candidate
University of Minnesota
(612) 384-8351
http://www-users.cs.umn.edu/~bmiller

Re: Problem with the RETURN key

[Andreas Schwab]

Brad Miller <bmiller@cs.umn.edu> writes:

|> My window-system is mac

Which causes term/mac-win to be loaded, where return is bound.  So you
have something that explicitly unbounds it.

Andreas.

-- 
Andreas Schwab, SuSE Labs, schwab@suse.de
SuSE Linux AG, Deutschherrnstr. 15-19, D-90429 Nürnberg
Key fingerprint = 58CA 54C7 6D53 942B 1756  01D3 44D5 214B 8276 4ED5
"And now for something completely different."

Re: Problem with the RETURN key

[Brad Miller]

That makes sense I guess except that I've tried running Emacs with no 
startup file and I still have the problem.  So, I don't think its 
anything I've added that has caused return to become unbound.

I'm not sure where to start in catching whatever it is that is causing 
return to become unbound, but I'm willing to try if someone could give 
me a clue.

Brad

On Tuesday, December 17, 2002, at 08:55 AM, Andreas Schwab wrote:

> Brad Miller <bmiller@cs.umn.edu> writes:
>
> |> My window-system is mac
>
> Which causes term/mac-win to be loaded, where return is bound.  So you
> have something that explicitly unbounds it.
>
> Andreas.
>
> -- 
> Andreas Schwab, SuSE Labs, schwab@suse.de
> SuSE Linux AG, Deutschherrnstr. 15-19, D-90429 Nürnberg
> Key fingerprint = 58CA 54C7 6D53 942B 1756  01D3 44D5 214B 8276 4ED5
> "And now for something completely different."
>
Brad Miller
PhD Candidate
University of Minnesota
(612) 384-8351
http://www-users.cs.umn.edu/~bmiller

Re: Problem with the RETURN key

[Andreas Schwab]

Brad Miller <bmiller@cs.umn.edu> writes:

|> That makes sense I guess except that I've tried running Emacs with no
|> startup file and I still have the problem.  So, I don't think its anything
|> I've added that has caused return to become unbound.
|> 
|> I'm not sure where to start in catching whatever it is that is causing
|> return to become unbound, but I'm willing to try if someone could give me
|> a clue.

Just check whether term/mac-win is actually loaded.

Andreas.

-- 
Andreas Schwab, SuSE Labs, schwab@suse.de
SuSE Linux AG, Deutschherrnstr. 15-19, D-90429 Nürnberg
Key fingerprint = 58CA 54C7 6D53 942B 1756  01D3 44D5 214B 8276 4ED5
"And now for something completely different."

Re: Problem with the RETURN key

[Brad Miller]

term/mac-win was being loaded.  the problem was that the version of 
mac-win that was being loaded did not have an entry in function-key-map 
for return!

/usr/share/emacs/21.3.50/lisp/term/mac-win.el, the one that was loaded 
when I started up emacs, did not have the entry.

The version in my build directory did have it defined, so somehow I got 
out of sync in the confusion that surrounded the need to rebuild after 
the upgrade to 10.2.2

Sorry... Maybe this will clear up the problem for others that were 
having return key problems as well.

Brad

On Tuesday, December 17, 2002, at 09:33 AM, Andreas Schwab wrote:

> Brad Miller <bmiller@cs.umn.edu> writes:
>
> |> That makes sense I guess except that I've tried running Emacs with 
> no
> |> startup file and I still have the problem.  So, I don't think its 
> anything
> |> I've added that has caused return to become unbound.
> |>
> |> I'm not sure where to start in catching whatever it is that is 
> causing
> |> return to become unbound, but I'm willing to try if someone could 
> give me
> |> a clue.
>
> Just check whether term/mac-win is actually loaded.
>
> Andreas.
>
> -- 
> Andreas Schwab, SuSE Labs, schwab@suse.de
> SuSE Linux AG, Deutschherrnstr. 15-19, D-90429 Nürnberg
> Key fingerprint = 58CA 54C7 6D53 942B 1756  01D3 44D5 214B 8276 4ED5
> "And now for something completely different."
>
Brad Miller
PhD Candidate
University of Minnesota
(612) 384-8351
http://www-users.cs.umn.edu/~bmiller

Re: Problem with the RETURN key

[Ovidiu Predescu]

On Tuesday, Dec 17, 2002, at 06:55 US/Pacific, Andreas Schwab wrote:

> Brad Miller <bmiller@cs.umn.edu> writes:
>
> |> My window-system is mac
>
> Which causes term/mac-win to be loaded, where return is bound.  So you
> have something that explicitly unbounds it.
>
> Andreas.

I've got the same problem. Even if I move away ~/.emacs, the problem is 
still there.

I still need to test out Andrew's previous suggestion. I've been busy 
yesterday, but I hope I'll have some spare time to do it today. Now I 
need to get some sleep, but after watching the "LOTR: The Two Towers" 
is hard to have it ;)

Cheers,
Ovidiu

-- 
Ovidiu Predescu <ovidiu@apache.org>
http://webweavertech.com/ovidiu/weblog/

Re: Problem with the RETURN key

[Ovidiu Predescu]

On Tuesday, Dec 17, 2002, at 06:55 US/Pacific, Andreas Schwab wrote:

> Brad Miller <bmiller@cs.umn.edu> writes:
>
> |> My window-system is mac
>
> Which causes term/mac-win to be loaded, where return is bound.  So you
> have something that explicitly unbounds it.
>
> Andreas.

I've got the same problem. Even if I move away ~/.emacs, the problem is 
still there.

I still need to test out Andrew's previous suggestion. I've been busy 
yesterday, but I hope I'll have some spare time to do it today. Now I 
need to get some sleep, but after watching the "LOTR: The Two Towers" 
is hard to have it ;)

Cheers,
Ovidiu

-- 
Ovidiu Predescu <ovidiu@apache.org>
http://webweavertech.com/ovidiu/weblog/

Re: Problem with the RETURN key

[Ovidiu Predescu]

On Tuesday, Dec 17, 2002, at 06:55 US/Pacific, Andreas Schwab wrote:

> Brad Miller <bmiller@cs.umn.edu> writes:
>
> |> My window-system is mac
>
> Which causes term/mac-win to be loaded, where return is bound.  So you
> have something that explicitly unbounds it.
>
> Andreas.

I've got the same problem. Even if I move away ~/.emacs, the problem is 
still there.

I still need to test out Andrew's previous suggestion. I've been busy 
yesterday, but I hope I'll have some spare time to do it today. Now I 
need to get some sleep, but after watching the "LOTR: The Two Towers" 
is hard to have it ;)

Cheers,
Ovidiu

-- 
Ovidiu Predescu <ovidiu@apache.org>
http://webweavertech.com/ovidiu/weblog/