From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Andrew Hyatt Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: A proposal for removing obsolete packages Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2016 16:15:21 -0500 Message-ID: References: <83twmkkv16.fsf@gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1453583751 3010 80.91.229.3 (23 Jan 2016 21:15:51 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2016 21:15:51 +0000 (UTC) Cc: johnw@gnu.org, monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Richard Stallman Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Jan 23 22:15:46 2016 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1aN5X6-0001Hr-FO for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 23 Jan 2016 22:15:44 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:58566 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aN5X5-0008Jw-Ra for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 23 Jan 2016 16:15:43 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:46981) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aN5Ws-0008Gi-24 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 23 Jan 2016 16:15:31 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aN5Wo-0004Sg-T5 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 23 Jan 2016 16:15:30 -0500 Original-Received: from mail-qg0-x232.google.com ([2607:f8b0:400d:c04::232]:36721) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1aN5Wo-0004Sa-Op; Sat, 23 Jan 2016 16:15:26 -0500 Original-Received: by mail-qg0-x232.google.com with SMTP id e32so83642256qgf.3; Sat, 23 Jan 2016 13:15:26 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id :user-agent:mime-version:content-type; bh=8uFJFFh9Q+X1s16GYmPvOpNuaxMA6qTnj1v4BwRIWBw=; b=mtn0rXu8ZlE1zjwVXF//ZEY1xxv0EMnD8372NZ635roKi7ONjCmVioRRzpUrh5CeGk oV2iU3667Z0mUEDjhdAKULgmqbgJO/yRb4/qdoHCiR50HY+2opXFX4T3aruEGyPUIFn4 XSo5qlyl2FHpb8i9rOm7cM9XuieFkrV+6s1ZOxbV3176Z5fnPeSrBSYORpOLtdhkYkVR VJxIoLYE7TM93vdkmFZOMvNoGPbMIDBHPdoIEWqhvIZTNW86UjvjeqnvSaPa5ora56Ft dSaHZNR1+8uhBv5NFx1NKy87GK+78jbEMDHeR3tCyik5cZ6hCmiG9Rod2shbFbghey0W LyAw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to :message-id:user-agent:mime-version:content-type; bh=8uFJFFh9Q+X1s16GYmPvOpNuaxMA6qTnj1v4BwRIWBw=; b=i4n9stj0Rf1hU1Xrvq4NgYl9tiSt/ZN+EsGdHoy2BSp/eRBOppY//Kv2fd2WdUGvhe u18QInbVFSuVi7DpatfDwpqdfhdXxFDebReRqDX/py+lLF01uxusXQN0xh1BdjYWUAh5 jF3Q3RPUKKsNUeX3Ggm4tOBiytklyfGJ4vbJ7KgGC/mGtHUfdBd3hG1e0d/n15JpUqoa yXuCXINMxlcdhNT/Z9g4v1IjWJHxXFZt+RiI/pvGcN7+cKBbWZnn5v44tZz0zjaxw+bV /Pg3U6N4PdtCGYngekaqxiIC2hGo2nlHbDWr3ZN9HWjimg0eCCLNW8fFeg3NjdhJbwIc R/gg== X-Gm-Message-State: AG10YOSNIaEMQNHKWeVo90ztDI4G6+uzYBJrdQbPMcHQFzTqPrgNVigHc3nm8aFQ2RagjQ== X-Received: by 10.140.105.198 with SMTP id c64mr12377771qgf.94.1453583726088; Sat, 23 Jan 2016 13:15:26 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: from Andrews-MacBook-Pro.local.ahyatt-laptop (cpe-74-73-128-199.nyc.res.rr.com. [74.73.128.199]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id n83sm5587227qhn.20.2016.01.23.13.15.23 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 23 Jan 2016 13:15:24 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: (Richard Stallman's message of "Wed, 20 Jan 2016 22:02:43 -0500") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.1.50 (darwin) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2607:f8b0:400d:c04::232 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:198659 Archived-At: Richard Stallman writes: > [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] > [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] > [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > > > Someone will have to, at the right time, make an > > argument that the code should be removed, and be willing to advocate for > > it. This is too high a burden for code that's been in obsolete for years. > > I think the burden should be on people to advocate for it's continued > > existence. > > (You mean "its", not "it's".) > > I disagree. Deleting something that people once used > should not be semiautomatic. > > How about proposing some obsolete features for deletion > and we can think about deleting them in Emacs 25. Here are the packages that are eligible for deletion in Emacs 25 (all obsolete since before Emacs 24): awk-mode cl-compat iso-acc, iso-insert, iso-swed keyswap options resume scribe spell swedish sym-comp vc-mcvs Most of these seem to be unused. I did a Google search for each of them, but only resume.el and cl-compat had any notable reference. In addition, vc-mcvs states that it no longer works with vc in Emacs 23, so that seems like a pretty obvious candidate to go. And awk-mode is now implemented by cc-mode, I believe. I think we should delete all of these in Emacs 25. The one I'm least sure of deleting is cl-compat, because I don't know enough about the history of cl compatibility, and how much the current packages replace this one. But I think we should take a chance - if removing any package turns out to be a bad idea, we can put it back. Is there anything here you think would be dangerous to delete?