From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Daniel Fleischer Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [External] : Re: [PATCH] Package Installation in Tutorial Date: Sat, 04 Dec 2021 13:04:49 +0200 Message-ID: References: <864k7ro07p.fsf@mail.linkov.net> <835ys47pzx.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="35909"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (darwin) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Cancel-Lock: sha1:Ck2pwC2TzyXW8c0Mc3W3q2RcAvs= Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Dec 04 12:05:49 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mtSrV-0009AM-0U for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 04 Dec 2021 12:05:49 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:36086 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mtSrU-0005Nk-5E for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 04 Dec 2021 06:05:48 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:56406) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mtSqj-0004a5-6H for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 04 Dec 2021 06:05:01 -0500 Original-Received: from ciao.gmane.io ([116.202.254.214]:44800) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mtSqg-0002AZ-Gu for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 04 Dec 2021 06:05:00 -0500 Original-Received: from list by ciao.gmane.io with local (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mtSqe-0007gI-Hh for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 04 Dec 2021 12:04:56 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Received-SPF: pass client-ip=116.202.254.214; envelope-from=ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; helo=ciao.gmane.io X-Spam_score_int: 5 X-Spam_score: 0.5 X-Spam_bar: / X-Spam_report: (0.5 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, FORGED_GMAIL_RCVD=1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.248, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.248, NML_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:280906 Archived-At: Eli Zaretskii [2021-12-04 Sat 10:06] wrote: > Drew doesn't speak for the Emacs project, so don't be surprised when > his views contradict the project's practices and decision-making > process. He (consistently) opposes those as well. No need to differentiate and point out different opinions in the community, it's a good thing. I wouldn't want to stifle opinions, especially from people like Drew, whose work and commitment speaks for themselves. It's just I never thought about data-driven development around here. Everyone has an agenda, working on features they care about; at least discussions are conducted where people convince the maintainers in the necessity of the change, but almost never by using data/polls. I remember the Emacs survey of 2020; it was a private initiative (not FSF) with almost no impact on discussions here; at least that was my impression. I see the value of conservatism in the survival of Emacs up to this point. Obviously Emacs can grow in a proactive manner as well, in addition to a reactive manner of fixing things enough people complained about, per the criteria mentioned previously. -- Daniel Fleischer