From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "John Wiegley" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Adding use-package to ELPA Date: Sun, 06 Mar 2022 15:06:45 -0800 Message-ID: References: <87k0dbi7ol.fsf@posteo.net> <871qzgyfuo.fsf@posteo.net> <87ilsre5jf.fsf@posteo.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="9269"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.2 (darwin) Cc: chad , EMACS development team To: Philip Kaludercic Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Mon Mar 07 00:07:56 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1nQzyl-0002Ei-HI for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 07 Mar 2022 00:07:55 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:59824 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nQzyj-0004sm-NB for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 06 Mar 2022 18:07:53 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:47972) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nQzxm-0004CR-Bf for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 06 Mar 2022 18:06:54 -0500 Original-Received: from [2001:470:142:3::e] (port=60106 helo=fencepost.gnu.org) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nQzxm-0005uv-2n; Sun, 06 Mar 2022 18:06:54 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-Version:References:Date:In-Reply-To:Subject:To: From; bh=3G1DbFf8KPwvfYx1xJk/nRZO0jIMYdDYuo29fGX7m+s=; b=Jbzp7QRQ5wQd17AQDMl0 xY1Z56SAQfNGTOrJxXohUkKYA6teLH6EKauRW0wUuxd7pN/w0guc1Ci5OLJKIQgoWtt+1Hetu3rh7 93WtDrmIE9M2Bezf9BNe9IRZjLQ1GDzRAJJArpjNOSJq0jIoosBtHziJBiG4B0+3pkHKMBk88fLjX PsS2xLYMU0Nq4m5OYEx0CfGvMr87HCArA1vP/QhhOsGqtQQc04RcYppR7X78bkB41dCLchk4H0hCP VyIkYad6lfORseS+ArcNLR4mCNZuemUhEb6u7p1Snz0JUsRjtOPfVwmT3iFWctkjlBcNRP7bqfB0a H2z6nubiEKm+IQ==; Original-Received: from auth1-smtp.messagingengine.com ([66.111.4.227]:55831) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nQzxl-0003Mu-Ps; Sun, 06 Mar 2022 18:06:53 -0500 Original-Received: from compute4.internal (compute4.nyi.internal [10.202.2.44]) by mailauth.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5BBBC27C0054; Sun, 6 Mar 2022 18:06:52 -0500 (EST) Original-Received: from mailfrontend2 ([10.202.2.163]) by compute4.internal (MEProxy); Sun, 06 Mar 2022 18:06:52 -0500 X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Received: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvvddruddufedgtdegucetufdoteggodetrfdotf fvucfrrhhofhhilhgvmecuhfgrshhtofgrihhlpdfqfgfvpdfurfetoffkrfgpnffqhgen uceurghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucesvcftvggtihhpihgvnhhtshculddquddttddmne cujfgurhephffvufgjfffkfhgfgggtsehttdertddtredtnecuhfhrohhmpedflfhohhhn ucghihgvghhlvgihfdcuoehjohhhnhifsehgnhhurdhorhhgqeenucggtffrrghtthgvrh hnpeffudefhfevtddtheeivdekjeelhefgvdeitefggeelvdehteegfeegledvgfdtkeen ucffohhmrghinhepnhgvfigrrhhtihhsrghnshdrtghomhenucevlhhushhtvghrufhiii gvpedtnecurfgrrhgrmhepmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpehjohhhnhifodhmvghsmhhtphgruhht hhhpvghrshhonhgrlhhithihqdeikeejkedtleeggedqudejjeehfeekudeiqdhjohhhnh ifpeepghhnuhdrohhrghesnhgvfigrrhhtihhsrghnshdrtghomh X-ME-Proxy: Original-Received: by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA; Sun, 6 Mar 2022 18:06:51 -0500 (EST) In-Reply-To: <87ilsre5jf.fsf@posteo.net> (Philip Kaludercic's message of "Sun, 06 Mar 2022 10:31:16 +0000") Mail-Followup-To: Philip Kaludercic , chad , EMACS development team X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:286866 Archived-At: >>>>> "PK" == Philip Kaludercic writes: PK> The less concrete reason is tied to me being the maintainer of a PK> alternative package (setup on ELPA), that takes a different approach to PK> the issue of a configuration macro. As you can imagine, I prefer it over PK> `use-package', that I see as having inconsistencies and idiosyncrasies, PK> that should be addressed if it were added to the core. My only desire is the least inertia for users. Personally, I'd prefer it if setup, leaf and use-package were all in core, and let the user decide which one they wish to require at startup time. These types of packages are a bit special, because -- since they configure everything else -- it's best if they need the least configuration to become available. But I also understand that we tend to pick "a way" when something goes into core, and this results in maintainers having to make a choice of one over the other. At the moment my only compelling evidence for use-package I find is its current ubiquity. Most Emacs package I come across on GitHub these days offer a use-package form for configuration. It would be nice if these could be copied and pasted into one's .emacs with an absolute minimum of extra fuss. But I'm not asserting that use-package is the best solution to the underlying problem. I am interested to know more about the idiosyncrasies you've found. The core of use-package has become highly user-configurable, so maybe it's a problem that can be changed. -- John Wiegley GPG fingerprint = 4710 CF98 AF9B 327B B80F http://newartisans.com 60E1 46C4 BD1A 7AC1 4BA2