From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: =?utf-8?Q?Daniel_Mart=C3=ADn?= Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Entering emojis Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2021 19:41:03 +0200 Message-ID: References: <87cznths5j.fsf@gnus.org> <87ilxi7531.fsf@gnus.org> <875yth7bjr.fsf@gnus.org> <8335oltgyd.fsf@gnu.org> <837ddws6p5.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="35499"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.2 (darwin) Cc: Eli Zaretskii , larsi@gnus.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Stefan Kangas Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Fri Oct 29 19:45:14 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mgVwE-0008ra-Os for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 29 Oct 2021 19:45:11 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:41922 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mgVwD-0002a4-Hj for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 29 Oct 2021 13:45:09 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:33264) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mgVsQ-00005T-RS for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 29 Oct 2021 13:41:18 -0400 Original-Received: from sonic307-54.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com ([87.248.110.31]:39916) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mgVsN-00047Q-CY for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 29 Oct 2021 13:41:14 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.es; s=s2048; t=1635529268; bh=k9NvmEP+Tt9KYQq+FUfj01tG1yctZRmltea6hEZhW+g=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:References:Date:In-Reply-To:From:Subject:Reply-To; b=Z0xPyNui9RxRv66aLhw211D2XemAM096jRz2wdEFE8G9P6sdGFwamUNJd2k3qMUd0gT8jjVRpTlh1zc2mobztqnsJo4cQaw/NETLlN/Se8FpTnc6jUJOiS6s51pOxDYltdSeKa26MnH/ekwflLISzrVG262JfbhUcnOzoW/EJgIDVm0G5sJJ7fvlcOBbw90ZmbWJUi5QQDnJUGb55d7C21tS/TP9TdDakMjvy2d6L7Zs5g61sAbqC7vBca626pXHTXB5TZgRC4BdYMjFAVsrGfcrX6Zh1ZgdytGhJCxleD5LMbUQEWWjZwHnBPm/wGKjgKRocea8U+K++4cRKxPAhg== X-SONIC-DKIM-SIGN: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1635529268; bh=jKTfO8fe3l/pSHEOyvVcBTNgmP+EjHvP5hCotkKf+j+=; h=X-Sonic-MF:From:To:Subject:Date:From:Subject; b=SFus0EEoHaq3wRuJkhL6MHuBRrI69ipuRFNUxS++GPtpi8CHUiXureupTUzxEJUQZwdutjjhc4DHZqAmdDz1GgX3Bd4bkH0elS9wmI6KE8kLorHbqCXvl692e00DjdyhZE7Pm5jY0SuVvClMuYtAa4rAZHSBGu5fQZvFAmDTFQOUcYEV+88YhX6VGGSLUIHkTX/D8SUgH9pacCn42x2Oj1Wo7acqRnQFfCwp9fVDVytggNQmZuuAzVZD2F6EubOVumSQmq8Oc2GrnvSC+rZlI7sIHXaBxDzsqjid0moZKfLjWX9zv4wo4dhZiRDXNLObVvoVrAqo186bVwAwQcKUTA== X-YMail-OSG: P5VtKJ4VM1kiR9KRuRUZdTlAvmzDjakMZWGCOXLr7X6afUJiy8Fa6lkvtV2H5RH EuxIa9WFA9pk6CYeuDLpTc4nFGmAO8b87d9cS9ut8Ovg3GRw.1O8d90zQD.DJuXJa0VECjUA9GWN GNqwVbldq4TNI3wFX_C_MN4EQ6eW3yQIO_QPwILS3SzUk04xmpJwTrXed1A9VUmFxGVKrAp7U66j 3bZa8bhXhUO.KxbkSVpv5J8oO8eT5j2spE3D2uCz7MzdAVH_Bq0Pp0OmQWOHMfKIsSKmNCnG7e1s bGlK_SH9kK19LccemtuiHbeAZ45uvBal.AzddYdc5LzjCmXYlabAKNSnz0dCII6hDPEjOOjc0HUo nj5eP81L5HNR.ZCHmg4KRumsQvgbAgNfdCnDT5GFNceaZA_TfbskGAr1_40.ehrXPwaujWyX.IWZ 5NG.qvQQGy7Fmr5Cx8.lbi7i.7JKYLm1PvvzXNoVjEmExudA3oz87XXccJfKNzV5yx3JS1TtHzKw jUpvdARJYbzcb6mSDAfBYd6Rc2jGxHPvu8zb995y6Da.a7FScxuFxmWXtDwWWsz.vi1wdmXQIofi mMIlqj_4TfQNxTO.LbmkO6VALP6LZ6BpMmuLaRVxFD54aIrwhJ89YefhkYw3mmVmLUQyAEKwEN3q .tauyR0YHa1VwkfJTtO2I3tmrtYI77ltW.eMpI14N9xnJHg0tvPLjcLmb38BPQbyb9W.5e1mu3Po AHqZTZjvrvIIU.FJvBGEaARi3YWXN0PBjAZZntawrgkfJDMui5_IKz67c.VWmIK0NiL9pYsDhvkL ZMHAOL.UCHRsuiXt2nzUeCTgzTF95HBCR4o2axzngb X-Sonic-MF: Original-Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic307.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com with HTTP; Fri, 29 Oct 2021 17:41:08 +0000 Original-Received: by kubenode524.mail-prod1.omega.ir2.yahoo.com (VZM Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID d2bd5863ce6c1f20e967b6799bf4c377; Fri, 29 Oct 2021 17:41:04 +0000 (UTC) In-Reply-To: (Stefan Kangas's message of "Fri, 29 Oct 2021 07:43:05 -0700") X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.19198 mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.yahoo Received-SPF: pass client-ip=87.248.110.31; envelope-from=mardani29@yahoo.es; helo=sonic307-54.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_ENVFROM_END_DIGIT=0.25, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:278218 Archived-At: Stefan Kangas writes: > >> And second, the current behavior could be quite useful in the Emoji >> case as well. For example, consider the case where you typed the male >> version and you want to change it to the female version instead. Or >> when you copy-paste the Emoji from some other text, then want to >> change it in small ways. > [...] >> The behavior you suggest could be a user option, by default off, and >> not specific to Emoji. Changing the behavior unconditionally, or even >> making that the default of that option, makes no sense to me, since >> the current behavior is very old, and I never heard any complaints >> about it. > > Please note my complaint then. Although I'd like to not only complain > but also more constructively propose a solution: I think that > `delete-backward-char' should treat emojis as single characters by > default. > > I find the current behavior far from ideal, and note that it is > different from all other software I have seen. I also think it makes no > sense. Having to type DEL five times to remove an emoji is to my mind > clearly not the interface that most users will want. On one hand, the Unicode spec suggests that Emojis should be treated as single grapheme clusters, not only for cursor movement, but for editing operations as well. From https://www.unicode.org/reports/tr51: "A supported emoji modifier sequence should be treated as a single grapheme cluster for editing purposes (cursor moment, deletion, and so on); word break, line break, and so on." On the other hand, one of the most popular text editors, VSCode, doesn't follow these suggestions and follows the Emacs behavior: DEL deletes a code point, and deletes the entire grapheme cluster. LibreOffice also deletes emojis like Emacs.