From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Howard Melman Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: discoverability, better defaults and which-key in Emacs Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2024 15:16:29 -0500 Message-ID: References: <874jetaxri.fsf@jeremybryant.net> <86fryc1vsh.fsf@gnu.org> <86r0hu4qk8.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="34824"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Cancel-Lock: sha1:da2WJkSab4y4cXSjqAGporErHsg= Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Feb 03 07:54:48 2024 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1rW9vL-0008oQ-Q1 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 03 Feb 2024 07:54:47 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rW9v5-0004Mc-89; Sat, 03 Feb 2024 01:54:31 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rVzxq-0002AH-Fz for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 02 Feb 2024 15:16:42 -0500 Original-Received: from ciao.gmane.io ([116.202.254.214]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rVzxp-00074z-7r for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 02 Feb 2024 15:16:42 -0500 Original-Received: from list by ciao.gmane.io with local (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1rVzxl-00012m-R1 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 02 Feb 2024 21:16:37 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Received-SPF: pass client-ip=116.202.254.214; envelope-from=ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; helo=ciao.gmane.io X-Spam_score_int: 5 X-Spam_score: 0.5 X-Spam_bar: / X-Spam_report: (0.5 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, FORGED_GMAIL_RCVD=1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.25, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.249, NML_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sat, 03 Feb 2024 01:54:29 -0500 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:315789 Archived-At: writes: > On Fri, Feb 02, 2024 at 09:24:55PM +0200, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > >> Since we are talking about _enabling_ the feature, the >> above would mean that veteran users will need to be asked >> whether to _disable_ it. Wouldn't that be an annoyance? > > For this one it would, yes. An unexpected popup can ruin > my day. If, like disabling works, it would write to the init and it would be a one-time annoyance, I don't think it's a big deal. If this debuted with a handful of beginner features configured as such, the NEWS could mention it and tell vererans to put a small block of code in their init to turn off things they don't want. Veterans are more likely to read NEWS than newbies. > So I'd really, really like to know that it is actually > going to help someone, then I'd be willing to go the extra > mile and disable it for me. A lot of newbies find which-key very useful. I'm a long time user and often find it useful. Especially for "newfangled" prefixes like M-g, M-s, C-x x, etc. :) I don't know what other beginner features might qualify, that would have to be evaluated carefully, but for a few, this idea occurred to me as a way to have it enabled for newbies using a small variation of a mechanism that exists for a similar purpose. -- Howard