From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Stefan Monnier Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: emacs-29 acd462b0306: ; Improve the use-package manual Date: Sat, 10 Dec 2022 11:40:24 -0500 Message-ID: References: <167059642832.4265.15913417645926264658@vcs2.savannah.gnu.org> <20221209143348.961DEC0E4CA@vcs2.savannah.gnu.org> <87cz8rgr0h.fsf@posteo.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="27202"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Cc: Stefan Kangas , emacs-devel@gnu.org, Eli Zaretskii , John Wiegley To: Philip Kaludercic Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Dec 10 17:41:20 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1p42ud-0006rj-Tz for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 10 Dec 2022 17:41:20 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1p42ts-0001Jq-4T; Sat, 10 Dec 2022 11:40:32 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1p42tq-0001JX-Or for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 10 Dec 2022 11:40:30 -0500 Original-Received: from mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca ([132.204.25.50]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1p42tp-0003Pw-1V; Sat, 10 Dec 2022 11:40:30 -0500 Original-Received: from pmg1.iro.umontreal.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by pmg1.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 02F51100134; Sat, 10 Dec 2022 11:40:27 -0500 (EST) Original-Received: from mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (unknown [172.31.2.1]) by pmg1.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 9052310010F; Sat, 10 Dec 2022 11:40:25 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=iro.umontreal.ca; s=mail; t=1670690425; bh=Cyp2KTeMAJEgDFWutSBPA3reW+dn5zutWyMtGW3G5nA=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Date:From; b=jBuQf8fGF06fuspvCmMZGDggXbO/4bsi09aHyMWEyhGt3vO7gvjZOq4N5ijFAJxhN LS7svATj12GVeiK5p/btD0AMqLj2ke+Uh3VDg24AAYs1R/aQxrG0pfdXU6bWvJClT0 sXxuZ4B30fI0/WrN8/MqMtMF9oZGkVd0OL59V0jGap9ppIWU/Ho+2BYSt4LbBmmWBC g6joVw1BYZpjmgtIlS6Y2anFHvVZyDV7q46zAmOy9qQ2XsmVZRHOKr0Tqmw3R4TSsh LPvsGLzfBFm7FZy64DJCJncvC6ZaZ0xjG8ZNiJNQAWFSGiBknCW0Lm1zAeDJtqgDMX iOELGUhPJNpbw== Original-Received: from pastel (unknown [45.72.193.52]) by mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 53CB0120E74; Sat, 10 Dec 2022 11:40:25 -0500 (EST) In-Reply-To: <87cz8rgr0h.fsf@posteo.net> (Philip Kaludercic's message of "Sat, 10 Dec 2022 16:30:54 +0000") Received-SPF: pass client-ip=132.204.25.50; envelope-from=monnier@iro.umontreal.ca; helo=mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca X-Spam_score_int: -42 X-Spam_score: -4.3 X-Spam_bar: ---- X-Spam_report: (-4.3 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:301122 Archived-At: Philip Kaludercic [2022-12-10 16:30:54] wrote: > Stefan Monnier writes: >> It would be nice to try and evolve `use-package` towards a default >> behavior that's more aligned with current best practices rather than >> what was done back when installing a package meant reading the >> "Commentary:" section and copying a chunk of ELisp code into your >> init file. > Is this possible without breaking the backwards compatibility? Without a doubt. Here in Emacs we have almost 40 years of experience of evolving things while preserving (some) backward compatibility. > It would also be nice to have user options like > 'use-package-always-defer' enabled by default, but that will certainly > break a number of configurations. Those users can always (setq use-package-always-defer nil) to recover the old behavior. Stefan