From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Stefan Monnier Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Shift-movement selection Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 14:38:51 -0400 Message-ID: References: <200803050637.m256bXL3008361@sallyv1.ics.uci.edu> <87hcfkdhqk.fsf@stupidchicken.com> <87d4q8sq9c.fsf@jurta.org> <8763w0n393.fsf@catnip.gol.com> <871w6ounk0.fsf@kfs-lx.rd.rdm> <87ablacdxt.fsf@catnip.gol.com> <87skyzzeng.fsf@catnip.gol.com> <87pru2i527.fsf@catnip.gol.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1205260773 20960 80.91.229.12 (11 Mar 2008 18:39:33 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 18:39:33 +0000 (UTC) Cc: juri@jurta.org, cyd@stupidchicken.com, storm@cua.dk, rms@gnu.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Miles Bader Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Mar 11 19:39:59 2008 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1JZ9OE-0006HH-Nk for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 11 Mar 2008 19:39:55 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1JZ9Ng-0002z2-BN for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 11 Mar 2008 14:39:20 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1JZ9Nb-0002y5-O3 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 11 Mar 2008 14:39:15 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1JZ9Nb-0002xr-Ax for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 11 Mar 2008 14:39:15 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1JZ9Nb-0002xn-1h for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 11 Mar 2008 14:39:15 -0400 Original-Received: from mercure.iro.umontreal.ca ([132.204.24.67]) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1JZ9NU-0008Gc-04; Tue, 11 Mar 2008 14:39:08 -0400 Original-Received: from hidalgo.iro.umontreal.ca (hidalgo.iro.umontreal.ca [132.204.27.50]) by mercure.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF9AA2CF9EB; Tue, 11 Mar 2008 14:39:07 -0400 (EDT) Original-Received: from faina.iro.umontreal.ca (faina.iro.umontreal.ca [132.204.26.177]) by hidalgo.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 924E23FE0; Tue, 11 Mar 2008 14:38:51 -0400 (EDT) Original-Received: by faina.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix, from userid 20848) id 73BB66CAA2; Tue, 11 Mar 2008 14:38:51 -0400 (EDT) In-Reply-To: <87pru2i527.fsf@catnip.gol.com> (Miles Bader's message of "Tue, 11 Mar 2008 07:32:00 +0900") User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.0.60 (gnu/linux) X-DIRO-MailScanner-Information: Please contact the ISP for more information X-DIRO-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-DIRO-MailScanner-SpamCheck: n'est pas un polluriel, SpamAssassin (score=-2.82, requis 5, autolearn=not spam, ALL_TRUSTED -2.82) X-DIRO-MailScanner-From: monnier@iro.umontreal.ca X-detected-kernel: by monty-python.gnu.org: Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:92174 Archived-At: >>> Anything that doesn't modify the buffer -- e.g. all movement commands. >> >> Supposedly these will be changed to use the new function, so they will >> explicitly deactivate the mark if the mark was activated with shift and >> the movement is then performed without the shift. >> >> So again, which ones would be left? > Are you serious? You intend to modify _every_ movement command in > Emacs, and require that users modify whatever commands they have > written? Actually, that's not a requirement. The failure to change one such command is pretty harmless. It just means that you can't combine the command with a shift to select the region, and that if the region was selected with a shift and you use this command without a shift, it will fail to deactivate the region. The first will disappoint the user, and the second may surprise him (tho pc-select worked this way for years before someone complained), but neither sounds terrible, so the commands can be changed little-by-little. > You intend to do this when a simple, clean, and more general > solution exists, with no apparent downsides? Haven't yet seen other "simple and clean" solutions. > Maybe for activating shift-selection, annotating commands is the best we > can do, but it's very clear that for deactivating it, we can do better. If a change is needed for activation, I see no harm in using the same change for deactivation. This said, I'm not opposed to using the `only' thingy for the deactivation. Stefan