From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Stefan Monnier Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Comments on setopt Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2022 08:23:25 -0500 Message-ID: References: <871r05rr2r.fsf@posteo.net> <87a6esztjj.fsf@yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="20403"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: Rudolf =?utf-8?Q?Adamkovi=C4=8D?= , Po Lu , larsi@gnus.org, philipk@posteo.net, rms@gnu.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Phil Sainty Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Feb 16 14:25:01 2022 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1nKKIm-00056J-B4 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 16 Feb 2022 14:25:00 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:46610 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nKKIl-0007K4-2D for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 16 Feb 2022 08:24:59 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:43766) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nKKHP-0005be-0l for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 16 Feb 2022 08:23:35 -0500 Original-Received: from mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca ([132.204.25.50]:14391) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1nKKHL-0001Aq-I9; Wed, 16 Feb 2022 08:23:33 -0500 Original-Received: from pmg3.iro.umontreal.ca (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pmg3.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 9D752440C86; Wed, 16 Feb 2022 08:23:28 -0500 (EST) Original-Received: from mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (unknown [172.31.2.1]) by pmg3.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 51671440BDA; Wed, 16 Feb 2022 08:23:27 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=iro.umontreal.ca; s=mail; t=1645017807; bh=pfa+C0bhKPH+ij7i9Ob4ru6o4C2rfGoKhtm5/lP2epg=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:References:Date:In-Reply-To:From; b=l0An6WnMbNGjSN3U2BBBXLYiY5N5SZMH/1UPW9eo3WFS6y4FpxF1fXy049NKEBeX1 /q44mqC7gMxgvT6WinMOoeR/xX44L2bhVz0M68W2cZ3cXchSA8K8xDBXtGto5yKTHU jY8cQp2ZModfG8tpCCj/75HGXWtllkdNNnxl48I4tZsghoJiprtVckqkWbd0AQfiGM pun7T7kwTClKfADEtBX4ftyMr9NFNotGWmC/Qcgr6JarJYJc6OENXGX6+YnZtQ+HEL q1bWD2/JaD8yilgwwguWjiwZDc52opFbPZiZEslOBGBNFrFFkHWgPyEC5qLNF+rWnM uH+we9PiQsteQ== Original-Received: from pastel (unknown [45.72.237.157]) by mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 0C419120811; Wed, 16 Feb 2022 08:23:27 -0500 (EST) In-Reply-To: (Phil Sainty's message of "Wed, 16 Feb 2022 22:52:53 +1300") Received-SPF: pass client-ip=132.204.25.50; envelope-from=monnier@iro.umontreal.ca; helo=mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca X-Spam_score_int: -42 X-Spam_score: -4.3 X-Spam_bar: ---- X-Spam_report: (-4.3 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:286384 Archived-At: > over using `customize-set-variable' directly (indeed, I believe the > verbosity of the name `customize-set-variable' is a significant reason > why many people prefer to use `setq' for everything, even when they > know that user options can have setters). Hmm... I'm not sure I understand the motivation behind the introduction of `setopt`, to be honest. As pointed out, `setopt` should probably not be used at top-level in a `.emacs` because Custom will think this was set via `customize-set-variables` and will save that setting back into `custom-file` next time we ask to save the customized variables. As a general rule, it should also be avoided by packages because packages shouldn't change user options behind the user's back. So the remaining places where it makes sense to use it are fairly rare, AFAICT. Am I missing something? Stefan