From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Stefan Monnier Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: delete-selection-mode as default Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2018 09:34:52 -0400 Message-ID: References: <83k1nxvm5j.fsf@gnu.org> <87sh2ih0bp.fsf@fastmail.fm> <770f48a8-664a-40ae-8e03-19f6aad248b6@default> <20180910104522.7e5cdf8a@gmail.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1536586389 5361 195.159.176.226 (10 Sep 2018 13:33:09 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2018 13:33:09 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.0.50 (gnu/linux) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Sep 10 15:33:05 2018 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1fzMJM-0001HG-73 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 10 Sep 2018 15:33:04 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:51747 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fzMLS-0003tB-A5 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 10 Sep 2018 09:35:14 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:50241) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fzMLK-0003sz-Ox for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 10 Sep 2018 09:35:07 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fzMLF-0008LY-Ot for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 10 Sep 2018 09:35:06 -0400 Original-Received: from [195.159.176.226] (port=46541 helo=blaine.gmane.org) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fzMLF-0008JM-Gg for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 10 Sep 2018 09:35:01 -0400 Original-Received: from list by blaine.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1fzMJ6-0000xw-7E for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 10 Sep 2018 15:32:48 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Original-Lines: 23 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org Cancel-Lock: sha1:sSoxxx+qEatna07FySvAL1LGVZ8= X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 195.159.176.226 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:229629 Archived-At: > Emacs should not half-ass the embracing of new users. Either go the > full hog - CUA, C-z undo, C-y redo (real redo), C-s save, C-a select > all, shift-selection-mode, right-click context menu. Only then there > is any hope for the non-manual-readers. There are two separate issues: 1- what is the best UI (according to us) 2- what we should do for new users As maintainer, I used (1) rather than (2) as my guide to choose the default settings. Whether the best UI has d-s-m enabled or disabled is under discussion. My opinion is that regarding point (1) d-s-m doesn't matter much: both choices are about equally good. So I'd favor enabling it (after fixing its implementation) on the grounds that it's what other UIs do. But just because for this particular choice, I/we end up deciding of the default value based on (2), that doesn't mean that it should be the case for everything else. Stefan