From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: Stefan Monnier Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: dash.el [was: Re: Imports / inclusion of s.el into Emacs] Date: Mon, 18 May 2020 16:19:48 -0400 Message-ID: References: <0c88192c-3c33-46ed-95cb-b4c6928016e3@default> <873686bbl5.fsf@russet.org.uk> <87d07963ec.fsf@fastmail.fm> <873685dq73.fsf@russet.org.uk> <87wo5gc0kb.fsf@russet.org.uk> <87lflv5yzx.fsf@bernoul.li> <433E8CA0-CC87-4877-B9D4-D348531B73F8@medranocalvo.com> <87lflsyfwu.fsf@russet.org.uk> <4353C482-F4C4-4D56-9588-827E8BC37F7E@medranocalvo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="23818"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.0.50 (gnu/linux) Cc: jonas@bernoul.li, Richard Stallman , joostkremers@fastmail.fm, emacs-devel@gnu.org, ohwoeowho@gmail.com, self@gkayaalp.com, Phillip Lord To: =?windows-1252?Q?Adri=E1n_Medra=F1o?= Calvo Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Mon May 18 22:21:37 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jamGX-00064Z-5V for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 18 May 2020 22:21:37 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:48732 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jamGW-00047s-3X for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 18 May 2020 16:21:36 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:59554) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jamEw-0002C4-MA for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 18 May 2020 16:19:58 -0400 Original-Received: from mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca ([132.204.25.50]:37989) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jamEr-00047S-RM; Mon, 18 May 2020 16:19:57 -0400 Original-Received: from pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id B5A4F80B39; Mon, 18 May 2020 16:19:51 -0400 (EDT) Original-Received: from mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (unknown [172.31.2.1]) by pmg2.iro.umontreal.ca (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 1039280723; Mon, 18 May 2020 16:19:50 -0400 (EDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=iro.umontreal.ca; s=mail; t=1589833190; bh=VilPRuG6TfuYeecx2NXmEiCQtDcn16hab5oBJFhBM/E=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:References:Date:In-Reply-To:From; b=W/cdsR2BiN2lBmoHlqpH56YDC+Hp8Gmp4fO9NrDFy7Zw8FW7+6HjTLb2Z95uufIhK i6H1arh4mHhiMnN1tqmyjwOXQcZzLsn0csr+pYR8nh49VcWeq24y8R3opG2ND/aybn VnQJekF6ndTIEHGoPvtbY7EoHoe+SdQKYvoxZcapBLuvH+f0Pp5mLI23f45dN/ilbm MOB8aJze/b6sUR3hmC8fvgU8p3/Iiz4QVYhCPRJB9jwbcPd0mjxqtFgkqoI1RPCjnF UZimk924F/o3dYDKvQjBwNcRmdUl3vYFHYEu2vcKgDNZ/JNi8xt3/InVrfIjdBi/i8 BmMxnp5PcG42A== Original-Received: from alfajor (unknown [216.154.27.250]) by mail01.iro.umontreal.ca (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 945411207C6; Mon, 18 May 2020 16:19:49 -0400 (EDT) In-Reply-To: <4353C482-F4C4-4D56-9588-827E8BC37F7E@medranocalvo.com> (=?windows-1252?Q?=22Adri=E1n=09Medra=F1o?= Calvo"'s message of "Mon, 18 May 2020 20:29:26 +0200") Received-SPF: pass client-ip=132.204.25.50; envelope-from=monnier@iro.umontreal.ca; helo=mailscanner.iro.umontreal.ca X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: First seen = 2020/05/18 15:30:35 X-ACL-Warn: Detected OS = Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Spam_score_int: -42 X-Spam_score: -4.3 X-Spam_bar: ---- X-Spam_report: (-4.3 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001 autolearn=_AUTOLEARN X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:250821 Archived-At: > I understand your argument, particularly as it applies to the > reader syntax. On the other hand, dollar.el is just a macro: it > does not complicate the syntax (for some definition of syntax); > although it does complicate understanding when first presented. Don't get me wrong: if I were to design Elisp from scratch, I'd most probably choose a syntax for functions which has a handy "no explicit parameter names" shorthand like `#(f % 1)` and also naturally generalizes to the "fully explicit parameter names". But I can't see a way to get a "shorthand" syntax sufficiently close to the existing "longhand" syntax for this to work well. I guess we could try to do "the opposite" of what you do, and support (lambda [f $1 5]) which `prettify-symbols-mode` displays as (=CE=BB [f $1 5]) But even there, I'm not sure the benefit is worth the added complexity for the occasional user trying to make sense of a few Elisp snippets. > Would prettifying lambda to =CE=BB lead to visually unexpected indentatio= n? It does, occasionally, yes, as in: (lambda (x) (+ x 5)) vs (=CE=BB (x) (+ x 5)) I know because I use `prettify-symbols-mode` ;-) Stefan