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From: Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca>
To: Pip Cet <pipcet@protonmail.com>
Cc: Stefan Kangas <stefankangas@gmail.com>,
	 Helmut Eller <eller.helmut@gmail.com>,
	 emacs-devel@gnu.org
Subject: Re: Merging scratch/no-purespace to remove unexec and purespace
Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2025 19:09:56 -0500	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <jwv1pxjla89.fsf-monnier+emacs@gnu.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <87plljfxu5.fsf@protonmail.com> (Pip Cet's message of "Sun, 22 Dec 2024 17:10:55 +0000")

>> and the "special set" above is what we usually call the "remembered set".
>
> TBH, I'm not entirely sure about that one, and I see I misspoke there;
> while the object remains immortal (and thus "tenured"), it's no longer
> considered skippable; in effect, the object combines the disadvantages
> of being young and being old, permanently, rather than clearly being one
> of the two.  I guess you could say we turn it into an additional root?

AFAIK in the context of generational GC, when a write-barrier records
a mutation in the old/tenured object, different GCs make different
choices w.r.t what is recorded in the "remembered set": the set may
record the new target of the pointer that's assigned (assuming it's
a pointer), or it record the address of the field that's mutated, or it
can record the actual object that's mutated, or it records a "card"
(i.e. a somewhat arbitrary memory region that contains the field,
usually sized and aligned on a power of 2), ...

So IMO what you describe still sits comfortably within the scope of
"remembered set".

> It becomes much closer to generational GC if you reintroduce "major" GCs
> which would recalculate the tenure of all objects, but that's where we
> hit the limits of "quick hack" territory, and I don't see a way of
> detecting when we would want to do so automatically.

Generational GCs don't have "a way of detecting when we would want to do
[a major GC] automatically" either.  They just use heuristics.

Regarding "quick hack", I think the main issue is the write barrier.


        Stefan




  reply	other threads:[~2025-01-04  0:09 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 60+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2024-12-17 10:47 Merging scratch/no-purespace to remove unexec and purespace Stefan Kangas
2024-12-17 13:12 ` Gerd Möllmann
2024-12-17 14:20   ` Gerd Möllmann
2024-12-17 14:30     ` Gerd Möllmann
2024-12-17 17:56       ` Gerd Möllmann
2024-12-17 18:50         ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-12-17 18:56           ` Gerd Möllmann
2024-12-18 12:55             ` Andrea Corallo
2024-12-18 14:03               ` Gerd Möllmann
2024-12-18 16:05                 ` Pip Cet via Emacs development discussions.
2024-12-18 16:30                   ` Gerd Möllmann
2024-12-18 16:25                 ` Pip Cet via Emacs development discussions.
2024-12-18 22:27                   ` Andrea Corallo
2024-12-19  9:28                     ` Pip Cet via Emacs development discussions.
2024-12-19 10:38                       ` Andrea Corallo
2024-12-19 10:50                       ` Stefan Kangas
2024-12-19 12:08                         ` Pip Cet via Emacs development discussions.
2024-12-19 17:55                           ` Stefan Kangas
2024-12-19 20:13                             ` Pip Cet via Emacs development discussions.
2024-12-20 15:59                               ` Stefan Monnier
2024-12-20 16:22                                 ` Pip Cet via Emacs development discussions.
2024-12-20 17:25                                   ` Gerd Möllmann
2024-12-20 20:35                                     ` Andrea Corallo
2024-12-20 20:39                                       ` Pip Cet via Emacs development discussions.
2024-12-21  6:33                                         ` Gerd Möllmann
2024-12-21  6:56                                         ` Andrea Corallo
2024-12-20 20:38                                     ` Pip Cet via Emacs development discussions.
2024-12-20 20:57                                       ` Gerd Möllmann
2025-01-03 22:36                               ` Pip Cet via Emacs development discussions.
2025-01-03 23:50                                 ` Stefan Monnier
2025-01-04  7:26                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2025-01-04 11:12                                   ` Pip Cet via Emacs development discussions.
2025-01-04 13:50                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2025-01-06 19:05                                       ` Andrea Corallo
2025-01-07 12:46                                         ` Pip Cet via Emacs development discussions.
2024-12-20  8:42                             ` Pip Cet via Emacs development discussions.
2024-12-18  0:18         ` Stefan Kangas
2024-12-17 19:30 ` Helmut Eller
2024-12-17 20:47   ` Stefan Monnier
2024-12-18  2:15     ` Stefan Kangas
2024-12-18  7:11       ` Helmut Eller
2024-12-18 13:35         ` Pip Cet via Emacs development discussions.
2024-12-18  6:56     ` Helmut Eller
2024-12-21 17:41       ` Helmut Eller
2024-12-21 18:32         ` Gerd Möllmann
2024-12-21 22:19         ` Pip Cet via Emacs development discussions.
2024-12-22  1:28         ` Stefan Kangas
2024-12-22 11:12           ` Pip Cet via Emacs development discussions.
2024-12-22 13:07             ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-12-22 14:12               ` Pip Cet via Emacs development discussions.
2024-12-22 15:51             ` Stefan Monnier
2024-12-22 17:09               ` Gerd Möllmann
2024-12-22 17:10               ` Pip Cet via Emacs development discussions.
2025-01-04  0:09                 ` Stefan Monnier [this message]
2024-12-22 13:13           ` Pip Cet via Emacs development discussions.
2024-12-22 14:16           ` Helmut Eller
2024-12-18  9:30   ` Pip Cet via Emacs development discussions.
2024-12-18  0:50 ` Po Lu
2024-12-18  2:12   ` Stefan Kangas
2024-12-18 21:26   ` Stefan Monnier

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