From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Uday S Reddy Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: base Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2010 10:07:53 +0100 Message-ID: References: <20100822120642.GA1794@muc.de> <87bp8uzu9d.fsf@mithlond.arda> <871v9o7dmf.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <87wrrg5rzg.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <87r5ho5gyr.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <87hbij6hib.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <87k4nf7ezq.fsf@catnip.gol.com> <878w3v7dd2.fsf@catnip.gol.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1282727772 6546 80.91.229.12 (25 Aug 2010 09:16:12 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2010 09:16:12 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Aug 25 11:16:11 2010 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OoC5a-0007Mx-4L for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 25 Aug 2010 11:16:10 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47383 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1OoBxw-0008Tw-4C for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 25 Aug 2010 05:08:16 -0400 Original-Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=47642 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1OoBxo-0008S0-UC for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 25 Aug 2010 05:08:09 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OoBxn-0004j8-L2 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 25 Aug 2010 05:08:08 -0400 Original-Received: from lo.gmane.org ([80.91.229.12]:54843) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OoBxn-0004ik-6A for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 25 Aug 2010 05:08:07 -0400 Original-Received: from list by lo.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OoBxl-00085z-A1 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 25 Aug 2010 11:08:05 +0200 Original-Received: from cpc10-harb6-0-0-cust112.perr.cable.virginmedia.com ([92.232.137.113]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Wed, 25 Aug 2010 11:08:05 +0200 Original-Received: from u.s.reddy by cpc10-harb6-0-0-cust112.perr.cable.virginmedia.com with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Wed, 25 Aug 2010 11:08:05 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ Original-Lines: 30 Original-X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: cpc10-harb6-0-0-cust112.perr.cable.virginmedia.com User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.8) Gecko/20100802 Thunderbird/3.1.2 In-Reply-To: <878w3v7dd2.fsf@catnip.gol.com> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:129197 Archived-At: On 8/25/2010 1:19 AM, Miles Bader wrote: > I think it's related to bzr being inconsistent, complicated, and > confusing, with no simple mental model for users to latch onto, and > multiple operating modes poorly stitched together (it's not really clear > what bzr wants to be; sometimes it seems like its trying to be > everything at once -- and, predictably, failing at all as a result). The criticism is understandable, but I don't think it is true. I think simplicity was a key design goal of Bazaar. The attitude is that you don't have to understand how everything works. Just use these basic commands and we will take care of making it all work. That explains why the documentation is so meager. It also explains why they are so opposed to adding things like rebase, which require the users to have a deeper understanding of the process to use them correctly. My feeling is that Bazaar is mostly successful in delivering that simplicity. As a software guy, I can admire that. But also, as a software guy, I really want to know what is going on. That is where the problem is. I can't be sure, but the problem could probably be solved by somebody writing down a more in-depth manual of Bazaar. But I haven't seen any evidence that Bazaar is bad software. If I think that something should be possible and try it, either it gets rejected or it just works. I learn something along the way. There is a place for software like that in the bigger scheme of things. Cheers, Uday