* the new makefile faces
@ 2005-05-18 6:16 Dan Nicolaescu
2005-05-18 14:36 ` David Kastrup
` (5 more replies)
0 siblings, 6 replies; 17+ messages in thread
From: Dan Nicolaescu @ 2005-05-18 6:16 UTC (permalink / raw)
Hi!
Am I the only one that finds the new makefile-shell-face annoying?
It is unnecessarily distracting with that "seashell1" background.
IMHO it does not bring any useful visual information. In a Makefile
lines that start with an whitespace are either commands (and now
they are highlighted with the makefile-shell-face), or mistakes
(i.e. lines that don't start with a tab) and makefile-space-face is
great at showing those.
IMHO the makefile-targets-face is also annoying. The fact that it
using underlines is not great. IMHO the old setting was much better.
Do we really need new faces introduced at this point in the release
process?
Again this is all IMHO, but I have a feeling that I might not be the
only one that thinks like this. I apologize in advance if that turns
out not to be the case.
Thanks
--dan
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* Re: the new makefile faces
2005-05-18 6:16 the new makefile faces Dan Nicolaescu
@ 2005-05-18 14:36 ` David Kastrup
[not found] ` <92a5eb470505181213745efac9@mail.gmail.com>
2005-05-18 17:35 ` Glenn Morris
` (4 subsequent siblings)
5 siblings, 1 reply; 17+ messages in thread
From: David Kastrup @ 2005-05-18 14:36 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: emacs-devel
Dan Nicolaescu <dann@ics.uci.edu> writes:
> Am I the only one that finds the new makefile-shell-face annoying?
>
> It is unnecessarily distracting with that "seashell1" background.
Oh good grief. Seems like a blind person's idea of a pun.
> Do we really need new faces introduced at this point in the release
> process?
Only if accompanied by new patterns that render the mode completely
unusable for more than 3-line Makefiles.
> Again this is all IMHO, but I have a feeling that I might not be the
> only one that thinks like this. I apologize in advance if that turns
> out not to be the case.
You apologize for your opinion in case others don't share it? What is
this? Good Borg of the month contest?
--
David Kastrup, Kriemhildstr. 15, 44793 Bochum
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* Re: the new makefile faces
2005-05-18 6:16 the new makefile faces Dan Nicolaescu
2005-05-18 14:36 ` David Kastrup
@ 2005-05-18 17:35 ` Glenn Morris
2005-05-18 17:43 ` Sean O'Rourke
` (3 subsequent siblings)
5 siblings, 0 replies; 17+ messages in thread
From: Glenn Morris @ 2005-05-18 17:35 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: emacs-devel
Dan Nicolaescu wrote:
> Am I the only one that finds the new makefile-shell-face annoying?
Emphatically not. I usually love electric fruit salad, but this is
awful.
> Do we really need new faces introduced at this point in the release
> process?
The answer can only be "no".
This "feature freeze" is so liquid as to be effectively non-existent.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* Re: the new makefile faces
2005-05-18 6:16 the new makefile faces Dan Nicolaescu
2005-05-18 14:36 ` David Kastrup
2005-05-18 17:35 ` Glenn Morris
@ 2005-05-18 17:43 ` Sean O'Rourke
2005-05-19 6:49 ` Richard Stallman
2005-05-18 18:00 ` Romain Francoise
` (2 subsequent siblings)
5 siblings, 1 reply; 17+ messages in thread
From: Sean O'Rourke @ 2005-05-18 17:43 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: Dan Nicolaescu
Dan Nicolaescu <dann@ics.uci.edu> writes:
> Am I the only one that finds the new makefile-shell-face annoying?
No. I found them a horrid surprise when opening a makefile the other
day. My current Emacs has that set of changes, plus the dubious
font-lock-negation-char-face, completely removed. My question (which
someone else has raised as well) is whether anyone but the author
actually likes these changes.
/s
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* Re: the new makefile faces
2005-05-18 6:16 the new makefile faces Dan Nicolaescu
` (2 preceding siblings ...)
2005-05-18 17:43 ` Sean O'Rourke
@ 2005-05-18 18:00 ` Romain Francoise
2005-05-19 10:11 ` Sascha Wilde
2005-05-19 10:09 ` Lute Kamstra
2005-05-20 6:41 ` Romain Francoise
5 siblings, 1 reply; 17+ messages in thread
From: Romain Francoise @ 2005-05-18 18:00 UTC (permalink / raw)
Dan Nicolaescu <dann@ics.uci.edu> writes:
> Am I the only one that finds the new makefile-shell-face annoying?
I am too...
> It is unnecessarily distracting with that "seashell1" background.
Especially on ttys, where it's actually almost white. Text is now
displayed as (almost) white on white!
> IMHO the makefile-targets-face is also annoying. The fact that it
> using underlines is not great. IMHO the old setting was much better.
I agree.
> Do we really need new faces introduced at this point in the release
> process?
I don't think so either. Please revert these changes.
--
Romain Francoise <romain@orebokech.com> | Last night the whole of hell
it's a miracle -- http://orebokech.com/ | came down to bathe and dine
| with us.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* Re: the new makefile faces
2005-05-18 18:00 ` Romain Francoise
@ 2005-05-19 10:11 ` Sascha Wilde
2005-05-19 13:17 ` Kim F. Storm
0 siblings, 1 reply; 17+ messages in thread
From: Sascha Wilde @ 2005-05-19 10:11 UTC (permalink / raw)
On Wed, May 18, 2005 at 08:00:29PM +0200, Romain Francoise wrote:
> Dan Nicolaescu <dann@ics.uci.edu> writes:
>
> > Am I the only one that finds the new makefile-shell-face annoying?
>
> I am too...
Me too... :)
> > It is unnecessarily distracting with that "seashell1" background.
>
> Especially on ttys, where it's actually almost white. Text is now
> displayed as (almost) white on white!
At least here it's not only almost but indeed white on white.
And, the fontification with `makefile-shell-face' is buggy:
with:
target: foo.o \
bar.o
shell stuff
`bar.o' gets fontified as part of the shell code, which it isn't.
cheers
sascha
--
Sascha Wilde : The most exciting phrase to hear in science, the one
: that heralds new discoveries, is not "Eureka!" (I found
: it!) but "That's funny ..." -- Isaac Asimov
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* Re: the new makefile faces
2005-05-19 10:11 ` Sascha Wilde
@ 2005-05-19 13:17 ` Kim F. Storm
2005-05-19 22:24 ` Denis Bueno
2005-05-20 21:56 ` Richard Stallman
0 siblings, 2 replies; 17+ messages in thread
From: Kim F. Storm @ 2005-05-19 13:17 UTC (permalink / raw)
Sascha Wilde <wilde@sha-bang.de> writes:
> On Wed, May 18, 2005 at 08:00:29PM +0200, Romain Francoise wrote:
>> Dan Nicolaescu <dann@ics.uci.edu> writes:
>>
>> > Am I the only one that finds the new makefile-shell-face annoying?
>>
>> I am too...
>
> Me too... :)
I'm not sure what I think about the feature as such, but the timing of
the change is really bad -- especially since the feature obviously
isn't fully developed and tested, and getting everything right seems
to be tedious.
So I would strongly suggest that the make-mode changes are reverted
for now, so we can focus on the release. Please!
I'm not sure if there are part of the make-file changes that actually
fixed any bugs -- if so, those parts of the change could be installed
(if they can be separated).
--
Kim F. Storm <storm@cua.dk> http://www.cua.dk
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* Re: the new makefile faces
2005-05-19 13:17 ` Kim F. Storm
@ 2005-05-19 22:24 ` Denis Bueno
2005-05-20 21:56 ` Richard Stallman
1 sibling, 0 replies; 17+ messages in thread
From: Denis Bueno @ 2005-05-19 22:24 UTC (permalink / raw)
On 5/19/05, Kim F. Storm <storm@cua.dk> wrote:
> Sascha Wilde <wilde@sha-bang.de> writes:
>
> > On Wed, May 18, 2005 at 08:00:29PM +0200, Romain Francoise wrote:
> >> Dan Nicolaescu <dann@ics.uci.edu> writes:
> >>
> >> > Am I the only one that finds the new makefile-shell-face annoying?
> >>
> >> I am too...
> >
> > Me too... :)
I don't mind the faces much. The problem is that the font-locking
renders the mode *unusable* on any reasonable machine. I wrote an
8-line makefile, and as I was writing the 8th line, emacs hung for 5
or 10 minutes before I was able to type again. And when I did, it hung
again.
-Denis
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* Re: the new makefile faces
2005-05-19 13:17 ` Kim F. Storm
2005-05-19 22:24 ` Denis Bueno
@ 2005-05-20 21:56 ` Richard Stallman
2005-05-22 8:09 ` David Kastrup
2005-05-29 10:36 ` Romain Francoise
1 sibling, 2 replies; 17+ messages in thread
From: Richard Stallman @ 2005-05-20 21:56 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: emacs-devel
I sent Daniel mail to start discussing these changes with him.
After having the discussion I will decide what to do.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* Re: the new makefile faces
2005-05-20 21:56 ` Richard Stallman
@ 2005-05-22 8:09 ` David Kastrup
2005-05-29 10:36 ` Romain Francoise
1 sibling, 0 replies; 17+ messages in thread
From: David Kastrup @ 2005-05-22 8:09 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: emacs-devel, Kim F. Storm
Richard Stallman <rms@gnu.org> writes:
> I sent Daniel mail to start discussing these changes with him.
> After having the discussion I will decide what to do.
He does not read the list? In spite of doing major surgery on an
important mode, while Emacs is in feature freeze?
The recent ChangeLog entries suggest that he is not even aware about
the extensive complaints about font lock colors.
I think that everyone with CVS write access should be reading the
developer list, and everyone who is doing non-trivial checkins should
also read the pretest bug list.
--
David Kastrup, Kriemhildstr. 15, 44793 Bochum
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* Re: the new makefile faces
2005-05-20 21:56 ` Richard Stallman
2005-05-22 8:09 ` David Kastrup
@ 2005-05-29 10:36 ` Romain Francoise
2005-06-07 7:10 ` Miles Bader
1 sibling, 1 reply; 17+ messages in thread
From: Romain Francoise @ 2005-05-29 10:36 UTC (permalink / raw)
Richard Stallman <rms@gnu.org> writes:
> I sent Daniel mail to start discussing these changes with him.
> After having the discussion I will decide what to do.
It has now been more than a week. What was the outcome of this
discussion?
Thanks,
--
Romain Francoise <romain@orebokech.com> | You know that old saying,
it's a miracle -- http://orebokech.com/ | that you always hurt the ones
| you love? Well it works both
| ways.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* Re: the new makefile faces
2005-05-18 6:16 the new makefile faces Dan Nicolaescu
` (3 preceding siblings ...)
2005-05-18 18:00 ` Romain Francoise
@ 2005-05-19 10:09 ` Lute Kamstra
2005-05-20 6:41 ` Romain Francoise
5 siblings, 0 replies; 17+ messages in thread
From: Lute Kamstra @ 2005-05-19 10:09 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: emacs-devel
Dan Nicolaescu <dann@ics.uci.edu> writes:
> Am I the only one that finds the new makefile-shell-face annoying?
It's more than annoying on a 8-color console: it sets the background
color to white, while the foreground color of most of the text is
white as well.
Lute.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
* Re: the new makefile faces
2005-05-18 6:16 the new makefile faces Dan Nicolaescu
` (4 preceding siblings ...)
2005-05-19 10:09 ` Lute Kamstra
@ 2005-05-20 6:41 ` Romain Francoise
5 siblings, 0 replies; 17+ messages in thread
From: Romain Francoise @ 2005-05-20 6:41 UTC (permalink / raw)
Also, the fact that it now sets the mode name to "GNUmakefile",
"BSDmakefile" or "Makeppfile" isn't terribly useful either...
--
Romain Francoise <romain@orebokech.com> | The world is a fine place,
it's a miracle -- http://orebokech.com/ | and worth fighting for.
| --Ernest Hemingway
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 17+ messages in thread
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2005-05-18 6:16 the new makefile faces Dan Nicolaescu
2005-05-18 14:36 ` David Kastrup
[not found] ` <92a5eb470505181213745efac9@mail.gmail.com>
2005-05-18 19:15 ` Joshua Varner
2005-05-18 17:35 ` Glenn Morris
2005-05-18 17:43 ` Sean O'Rourke
2005-05-19 6:49 ` Richard Stallman
2005-05-18 18:00 ` Romain Francoise
2005-05-19 10:11 ` Sascha Wilde
2005-05-19 13:17 ` Kim F. Storm
2005-05-19 22:24 ` Denis Bueno
2005-05-20 21:56 ` Richard Stallman
2005-05-22 8:09 ` David Kastrup
2005-05-29 10:36 ` Romain Francoise
2005-06-07 7:10 ` Miles Bader
2005-06-13 14:03 ` Juanma Barranquero
2005-05-19 10:09 ` Lute Kamstra
2005-05-20 6:41 ` Romain Francoise
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