From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Okam Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Interactive guide for new users Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2020 03:13:54 +0000 Message-ID: References: <87o8lwu085.fsf@posteo.net> Reply-To: Okam Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="1436"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: casouri@gmail.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org, eduardo@mercovich.net, stefankangas@gmail.com, self@gkayaalp.com, eliz@gnu.org, drew.adams@oracle.com To: rms@gnu.org, "Philip K." Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat Sep 26 05:15:20 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1kM0gB-0000HC-VM for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 26 Sep 2020 05:15:19 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:37028 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kM0gB-0001Yg-0h for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 23:15:19 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:56550) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kM0f8-00016K-CB for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 23:14:14 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-40136.protonmail.ch ([185.70.40.136]:26739) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kM0f5-00040a-9A for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 25 Sep 2020 23:14:13 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=protonmail.com; s=protonmail; t=1601090046; bh=JjyXMwJVeDIE4e/pcqqPlP+7gOI0m9uZjU1ysRpug/Q=; h=Date:To:From:Cc:Reply-To:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:From; b=Va30RjMVB2T0OaeEE6SZRKuWswCF5h+ZM15ppezRq1lb4xnl+p1N86Jg3KDCX/z8c SVghCKe3ljQQtJ/5IPHUmCEVfj3StSzUQ2fT2IvSaZrlsB5XXzfgzDP7bwJUaiNmT1 C8dy4ocVwIUvztaN2V9MLd2r+0gEU0r4cFA49jQ4= In-Reply-To: Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.70.40.136; envelope-from=okamsn@protonmail.com; helo=mail-40136.protonmail.ch X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: First seen = 2020/09/25 23:14:07 X-ACL-Warn: Detected OS = Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] [fuzzy] X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:256440 Archived-At: On 9/23/20 9:32 PM, Richard Stallman wrote: >=20 > [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] > [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] > [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] >=20 > > Everyone with a .emacs file has a configuration, but that's not what > > Doom, Spacemacs, etc. provide. In a sense, they forked Emacs, withou= t > > forking the core code, instead providing a patch-set in Elisp form += a > > DSL. >=20 > I keep receiving different descriptions of what those things consist > of. I don't know which description is correct, but I can suggest a > term for each one. I haven't used Spacemacs in a while, but I want try to add some information= , if=20 it hasn't been said already. In the case of Spacemacs, it consists of groups of packages, which they cal= l=20 "layers", based around certain general features like spell-checking or a=20 particular programming language. For a programming language, a layer might= =20 include packages for things like syntax highlighting, error checking, and= =20 expanding snippets of text specifically for that language. When a user enables/disables a layer, they are enabling/disabling the colle= cted=20 packages that the Spacemacs developers think provide a good user experience= . To=20 facilitate working with so many packages, the Spacemacs developers have put= a=20 lot thought into the loading, interaction between, and configuration of sai= d=20 packages. Here are a few examples: - They have tried to create standard keybinding layouts, so that, for examp= le,=20 "SPC m s" is generally the keybinding used to launch any programming langua= ge=20 REPL that has a corresponding layer. This sort of consistency is helpful to= new=20 users. - They set up some form of package rollback for when a package update break= s the=20 configuration. - They have tried to create a repository containing of all the packages nee= ded=20 for any layer, that they have decided is a safe version. This should hopefu= lly=20 reduced problems caused by packages changing function names, etc. - They ask users to keep their personal configs in a "~/.spacemacs" file, t= o=20 better work with the deferred loading of packages that they have set up. All of these things can be done by a user of regular Emacs, because Spacema= cs is=20 indeed another Emacs config, but it would be a hassle for a normal user=20 (especially a new user) to do it at the scale/breadth the Spacemacs develop= ers=20 are attempting. They are not running their own version of Emacs, so calling it an "Emacs=20 distribution" is odd, but thinking of it as just a config file that people = copy=20 from doesn't really capture the effort of their work, I think, particularly= with=20 projects like Spacemacs and Doom creating their own sort of configuration s= ystem.