fullscreen and gnome

fullscreen and gnome

[Patrick Drechsler]

Hi,

starting emacs with `emacs -fs' ignores my window manager (gnome using 
Ubuntu 6.06="Dapper"). This means that Emacs covers the window manager 
panels at the top and bottom (default gnome settings using Ubuntu Dapper).

I am using a current CVS-checkout of Emacs:

GNU Emacs 22.0.91.14 (i686-pc-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 2.8.20) of 
2006-12-12 on trurl

Starting an Emacs session with

/usr/local/emacs/bin/emacs --no-site-file -Q -fs

results in the error described above (Emacs takes up the complete X: no 
panels, not even the toolbar, is displayed).

Patrick

Re: fullscreen and gnome

[Leo]

* Patrick Drechsler (2006-12-14 01:57 +0100) said:
  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> This means that Emacs covers the window manager panels at the top
> and bottom ...

That's what it means by fullscreen. Check out the fullscreen mode in
evince. You will see the same.

-- 
Leo <sdl.web AT gmail.com>                         (GPG Key: 9283AA3F)

Re: fullscreen and gnome

[Patrick Drechsler]

Leo wrote:
> * Patrick Drechsler (2006-12-14 01:57 +0100) said:
>   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>> This means that Emacs covers the window manager panels at the top
>> and bottom ...
> 
> That's what it means by fullscreen. Check out the fullscreen mode in
> evince. You will see the same.

Emacs has never done that in the past. Is this the expected behaviour?

In case this is the intended behaviour: Which option do I pass to the 
emacs command to have a fullscreen emacs which does _not_ cover the 
window manager panels (ie gnome)? I would like to prevent using a direct 
"--geometry" option because I use my ~/.emacs.d/init.el file in 
different environments.

Emacs is an editor. It should not have priority over the window manager 
used. IMHO.

Patrick

PS:

On a side note: I think that evince's default setting are also 
configured wrong (at least when using Ubuntu 6.06). IMHO.

Re: fullscreen and gnome

[Jan Djärv]

Patrick Drechsler skrev:
> Leo wrote:
>> * Patrick Drechsler (2006-12-14 01:57 +0100) said:
>>   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>> This means that Emacs covers the window manager panels at the top
>>> and bottom ...
>>
>> That's what it means by fullscreen. Check out the fullscreen mode in
>> evince. You will see the same.
> 
> Emacs has never done that in the past. Is this the expected behaviour?

Well, the -fs has not been present in any released Emacs so far.  That said, 
the extended window manager hints thing was added fairly recently, because 
that is what other people expect, i.e. like the mentioned evince.

> 
> In case this is the intended behaviour: Which option do I pass to the 
> emacs command to have a fullscreen emacs which does _not_ cover the 
> window manager panels (ie gnome)? I would like to prevent using a direct 
> "--geometry" option because I use my ~/.emacs.d/init.el file in 
> different environments.
> 
> Emacs is an editor. It should not have priority over the window manager 
> used. IMHO.

It does not, this is all the window manager doing stuff, in fact Emacs just 
tells the window manager, "make me fullscreen" and then the window manager 
does what it like.

> On a side note: I think that evince's default setting are also configured wrong 
 > (at least when using Ubuntu 6.06). IMHO.

Evince uses the same mechanism as Emacs, i.e. it is the window manager again 
that does it all.

	Jan D.

Re: fullscreen and gnome

[Patrick Drechsler]

Jan Djärv wrote:
> 
> 
> Patrick Drechsler skrev:
>> Leo wrote:
>>> * Patrick Drechsler (2006-12-14 01:57 +0100) said:
>>>   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>>> This means that Emacs covers the window manager panels at the top
>>>> and bottom ...
>>>
>>> That's what it means by fullscreen. Check out the fullscreen mode in
>>> evince. You will see the same.
>>
>> Emacs has never done that in the past. Is this the expected behaviour?
> 
> Well, the -fs has not been present in any released Emacs so far.  

I guess I have been using the CVS version for a while then ;-)

> That 
> said, the extended window manager hints thing was added fairly recently, 
> because that is what other people expect, i.e. like the mentioned evince.

OK, then it's a feature.

>> In case this is the intended behaviour: Which option do I pass to the 
>> emacs command to have a fullscreen emacs which does _not_ cover the 
>> window manager panels (ie gnome)? I would like to prevent using a 
>> direct "--geometry" option because I use my ~/.emacs.d/init.el file in 
>> different environments.
>>
>> Emacs is an editor. It should not have priority over the window 
>> manager used. IMHO.
> 
> It does not, this is all the window manager doing stuff, in fact Emacs 
> just tells the window manager, "make me fullscreen" and then the window 
> manager does what it like.

Fair enough. Is there a proposed way of accomplishing the 
semi-fullscreen effect I am after?

>> On a side note: I think that evince's default setting are also 
>> configured wrong 
>  > (at least when using Ubuntu 6.06). IMHO.
> 
> Evince uses the same mechanism as Emacs, i.e. it is the window manager 
> again that does it all.

OK, obviously a matter of taste.

Thanks for your feedback Jan.

Patrick

Re: fullscreen and gnome

[Jan Djärv]

Patrick Drechsler skrev:
> Jan Djärv wrote:
>>
>>

>> It does not, this is all the window manager doing stuff, in fact Emacs 
>> just tells the window manager, "make me fullscreen" and then the 
>> window manager does what it like.
> 
> Fair enough. Is there a proposed way of accomplishing the 
> semi-fullscreen effect I am after?

Does not clicking on the window manager maximize button in the title bar do that?

	Jan D.

Re: fullscreen and gnome

[Patrick Drechsler]

Jan Djärv wrote:
> Patrick Drechsler skrev:
>> Jan Djärv wrote:
>>> It does not, this is all the window manager doing stuff, in fact 
>>> Emacs just tells the window manager, "make me fullscreen" and then 
>>> the window manager does what it like.
>>
>> Fair enough. Is there a proposed way of accomplishing the 
>> semi-fullscreen effect I am after?
> 
> Does not clicking on the window manager maximize button in the title bar 
> do that?

Yes, of course. I thought that there might be an option which I could 
pass to Emacs. I'll use the --geometry option instead.

Thanks for your feedback,

Patrick

Re: fullscreen and gnome

[Jan Djärv]

Patrick Drechsler skrev:
> Jan Djärv wrote:
>> Patrick Drechsler skrev:
>>> Jan Djärv wrote:
>>>> It does not, this is all the window manager doing stuff, in fact 
>>>> Emacs just tells the window manager, "make me fullscreen" and then 
>>>> the window manager does what it like.
>>>
>>> Fair enough. Is there a proposed way of accomplishing the 
>>> semi-fullscreen effect I am after?
>>
>> Does not clicking on the window manager maximize button in the title 
>> bar do that?
> 
> Yes, of course. I thought that there might be an option which I could 
> pass to Emacs. I'll use the --geometry option instead.
> 

If it is just metacity, I think this will do what you want (at least it does 
on the version of metacity with FC5):

(progn
   (x-send-client-message nil 0 nil
			 "_NET_WM_STATE"
			 32
			 '(1 "_NET_WM_STATE_MAXIMIZED_HORZ"))
   (x-send-client-message nil 0 nil
			 "_NET_WM_STATE"
			 32
			 '(1 "_NET_WM_STATE_MAXIMIZED_VERT")))

It can be put in .emacs for example.

Note that other window managers may do something different.

	Jan D.

Re: fullscreen and gnome

[Patrick Drechsler]

Jan Djärv wrote:
> Patrick Drechsler skrev:
>> Jan Djärv wrote:
>>> Patrick Drechsler skrev:
>>>> Jan Djärv wrote:
>>>>> It does not, this is all the window manager doing stuff, in fact 
>>>>> Emacs just tells the window manager, "make me fullscreen" and then 
>>>>> the window manager does what it like.
>>>>
>>>> Fair enough. Is there a proposed way of accomplishing the 
>>>> semi-fullscreen effect I am after?
>>>
>>> Does not clicking on the window manager maximize button in the title 
>>> bar do that?
>>
>> Yes, of course. I thought that there might be an option which I could 
>> pass to Emacs. I'll use the --geometry option instead.
>>
> 
> If it is just metacity, I think this will do what you want (at least it 
> does on the version of metacity with FC5):
[...functional code...]

Thank you Jan, your example code works fine. But as mentioned in my 
original post I was looking for a solution which is independent of the 
window manager/OS in use. I guess I'll just stick with the --geometry 
parameter.

Thanks

Patrick

Re: fullscreen and gnome

[James Cloos]

>>>>> "Patrick" == Patrick Drechsler <patrick@pdrechsler.de> writes:

Patrick> Thank you Jan, your example code works fine. But as mentioned
Patrick> in my original post I was looking for a solution which is
Patrick> independent of the window manager/OS in use. I guess I'll
Patrick> just stick with the --geometry parameter.

The technique Jan used for maximizing is the same as the technique
that the -fs flag uses to do full screen.  Both just set the window
manager hints for the specified display options.

The _NET_WM_STATE hints are standardized.  All modern window managers
should use them.

As such, they should be supported by everthing that you use.

You can run this on each platform to confirm:

:; xlsatoms |egrep _NET_WM

And you can use xprop to see the settings for any given window.  As an
example, I get this for the emacs frame I'm writing this in:

,----<xprop of an emacs frame>
| :; xprop
| _MOTIF_DRAG_RECEIVER_INFO(_MOTIF_DRAG_RECEIVER_INFO) = 0x6c, 0x0, 0x5, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0
| XdndAware(ATOM) = BITMAP
| _ICEWM_TRAY(CARDINAL) = 0
| _WIN_LAYER(CARDINAL) = 4
| _NET_WM_DESKTOP(CARDINAL) = 0
| _WIN_WORKSPACE(CARDINAL) = 0
| WM_STATE(WM_STATE):
| 		window state: Normal
| 		icon window: 0x0
| _NET_WM_STATE(ATOM) = _NET_WM_STATE_MAXIMIZED_VERT, _NET_WM_STATE_MAXIMIZED_HORZ
| _WIN_STATE(CARDINAL) = 12, 63
| WM_PROTOCOLS(ATOM): protocols  WM_DELETE_WINDOW, WM_TAKE_FOCUS, WM_SAVE_YOURSELF
| WM_CLIENT_LEADER(WINDOW): window id # 0xe00058
| WM_LOCALE_NAME(STRING) = "en_US.UTF-8"
| WM_CLASS(STRING) = "emacs", "Emacs"
| WM_HINTS(WM_HINTS):
| 		Client accepts input or input focus: True
| 		Initial state is Normal State.
| 		bitmap id # to use for icon: 0xe00062
| 		bitmap id # of mask for icon: 0xe00064
| WM_NORMAL_HINTS(WM_SIZE_HINTS):
| 		program specified size: 1594 by 1124
| 		program specified minimum size: 34 by 2
| 		program specified resize increment: 8 by 17
| 		window gravity: NorthWest
| WM_CLIENT_MACHINE(STRING) = "lugabout"
| WM_ICON_NAME(STRING) = "*wide reply to Patrick Drechsler*"
| WM_NAME(STRING) = "*wide reply to Patrick Drechsler*"
`----

As you can see, I have the window maximized (I used the wm's button on
the windows title bar to maximize it).

I'd expect that you will find that Jan's solution will Just Work.

-JimC
-- 
James Cloos <cloos@jhcloos.com>         OpenPGP: 1024D/ED7DAEA6

Re: fullscreen and gnome

[Jan Djärv]

James Cloos skrev:
>>>>>> "Patrick" == Patrick Drechsler <patrick@pdrechsler.de> writes:
> 
> Patrick> Thank you Jan, your example code works fine. But as mentioned
> Patrick> in my original post I was looking for a solution which is
> Patrick> independent of the window manager/OS in use. I guess I'll
> Patrick> just stick with the --geometry parameter.
> 
> The technique Jan used for maximizing is the same as the technique
> that the -fs flag uses to do full screen.  Both just set the window
> manager hints for the specified display options.
> 
> The _NET_WM_STATE hints are standardized.  All modern window managers
> should use them.
> 
> As such, they should be supported by everthing that you use.
> 
> You can run this on each platform to confirm:
> 
> :; xlsatoms |egrep _NET_WM
> 
> And you can use xprop to see the settings for any given window.  As an
> example, I get this for the emacs frame I'm writing this in:
> 
> ,----<xprop of an emacs frame>
> | :; xprop
> | _MOTIF_DRAG_RECEIVER_INFO(_MOTIF_DRAG_RECEIVER_INFO) = 0x6c, 0x0, 0x5, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0
> | XdndAware(ATOM) = BITMAP
> | _ICEWM_TRAY(CARDINAL) = 0
> | _WIN_LAYER(CARDINAL) = 4
> | _NET_WM_DESKTOP(CARDINAL) = 0
> | _WIN_WORKSPACE(CARDINAL) = 0
> | WM_STATE(WM_STATE):
> | 		window state: Normal
> | 		icon window: 0x0
> | _NET_WM_STATE(ATOM) = _NET_WM_STATE_MAXIMIZED_VERT, _NET_WM_STATE_MAXIMIZED_HORZ
> | _WIN_STATE(CARDINAL) = 12, 63
> | WM_PROTOCOLS(ATOM): protocols  WM_DELETE_WINDOW, WM_TAKE_FOCUS, WM_SAVE_YOURSELF
> | WM_CLIENT_LEADER(WINDOW): window id # 0xe00058
> | WM_LOCALE_NAME(STRING) = "en_US.UTF-8"
> | WM_CLASS(STRING) = "emacs", "Emacs"
> | WM_HINTS(WM_HINTS):
> | 		Client accepts input or input focus: True
> | 		Initial state is Normal State.
> | 		bitmap id # to use for icon: 0xe00062
> | 		bitmap id # of mask for icon: 0xe00064
> | WM_NORMAL_HINTS(WM_SIZE_HINTS):
> | 		program specified size: 1594 by 1124
> | 		program specified minimum size: 34 by 2
> | 		program specified resize increment: 8 by 17
> | 		window gravity: NorthWest
> | WM_CLIENT_MACHINE(STRING) = "lugabout"
> | WM_ICON_NAME(STRING) = "*wide reply to Patrick Drechsler*"
> | WM_NAME(STRING) = "*wide reply to Patrick Drechsler*"
> `----
> 
> As you can see, I have the window maximized (I used the wm's button on
> the windows title bar to maximize it).
> 
> I'd expect that you will find that Jan's solution will Just Work.

Well, there are always the old WM:s that don't support _NET_*.

	Jan D.

Re: fullscreen and gnome

[Patrick Drechsler]

Jan Djärv wrote:
> James Cloos skrev:
>>>>>>> "Patrick" == Patrick Drechsler <patrick@pdrechsler.de> writes:
>> Patrick> Thank you Jan, your example code works fine. But as mentioned
>> Patrick> in my original post I was looking for a solution which is
>> Patrick> independent of the window manager/OS in use. I guess I'll
>> Patrick> just stick with the --geometry parameter.
>>
>> The technique Jan used for maximizing is the same as the technique
>> that the -fs flag uses to do full screen.  Both just set the window
>> manager hints for the specified display options.
>>
>> The _NET_WM_STATE hints are standardized.  All modern window managers
>> should use them.
>>
>> As such, they should be supported by everthing that you use.
>>
>> You can run this on each platform to confirm:
>>
>> :; xlsatoms |egrep _NET_WM
>>
>> And you can use xprop to see the settings for any given window.  As an
>> example, I get this for the emacs frame I'm writing this in:
[...]
>> I'd expect that you will find that Jan's solution will Just Work.
> 
> Well, there are always the old WM:s that don't support _NET_*.

Thanks Jan and James (and sorry for the late reply) for your feedback. 
The code you posted actually works fine. Opposed to the subject I was 
subliminally hoping for a solution which would also work using Windows. 
I can see that this is not accomplished that easily. But one mouse click 
to maximize isn't that difficult either ;-)

Thanks again for your help,

Patrick

Re: fullscreen and gnome

[Patrick Drechsler]

Patrick Drechsler wrote:
> starting emacs with `emacs -fs' ignores my window manager (gnome 
> using Ubuntu 6.06="Dapper"). This means that Emacs covers the window 
> manager panels at the top and bottom (default gnome settings using 
> Ubuntu Dapper).
> 
> I am using a current CVS-checkout of Emacs:
> 
> GNU Emacs 22.0.91.14 (i686-pc-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 2.8.20) of 
> 2006-12-12 on trurl
> 
> Starting an Emacs session with
> 
> /usr/local/emacs/bin/emacs --no-site-file -Q -fs
> 
> results in the error described above (Emacs takes up the complete X: 
> no panels, not even the toolbar, is displayed).

My last sentence is not correct. Emacs' toolbar IS displayed.

Everything else is NOT displayed (ie panels from WM, frame(s) used by 
the WM (gnome), etc).

Patrick

Re: fullscreen and gnome

[Jan Djärv]

Patrick Drechsler skrev:
> Hi,
> 
> starting emacs with `emacs -fs' ignores my window manager (gnome using 
> Ubuntu 6.06="Dapper"). This means that Emacs covers the window manager 
> panels at the top and bottom (default gnome settings using Ubuntu Dapper).

Emacs uses the extended window manager hints if it detects a window manager 
that supports them.  By default, Gnome uses metacity so I guess that is what 
you have.  Then extended window manager hints is used, and it is up to the 
window manager to do whatever it pleases to make the window fullscreen. 
Metacity does indeed make the window take up the whole screen, with no window 
manager decorations visible.  So Emacs is not ignoring your window manager, it 
is your window manager who does all the work and has descided that this is 
what fullscreen shall look like.  If you don't like it, you have to file a bug 
on metacity.

> 
> I am using a current CVS-checkout of Emacs:
> 
> GNU Emacs 22.0.91.14 (i686-pc-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 2.8.20) of 
> 2006-12-12 on trurl
> 
> Starting an Emacs session with
> 
> /usr/local/emacs/bin/emacs --no-site-file -Q -fs
> 
> results in the error described above (Emacs takes up the complete X: no 
> panels, not even the toolbar, is displayed).

Do you mean that the Emacs toolbar dissapears?  That would be a bug.

	Jan D.

Re: fullscreen and gnome

[Patrick Drechsler]

Jan Djärv wrote:
> Patrick Drechsler skrev:
>> starting emacs with `emacs -fs' ignores my window manager (gnome using 
>> Ubuntu 6.06="Dapper"). This means that Emacs covers the window manager 
>> panels at the top and bottom (default gnome settings using Ubuntu 
>> Dapper).
> 
> Emacs uses the extended window manager hints if it detects a window 
> manager that supports them.  By default, Gnome uses metacity so I guess 
> that is what you have.  Then extended window manager hints is used, and 
> it is up to the window manager to do whatever it pleases to make the 
> window fullscreen. Metacity does indeed make the window take up the 
> whole screen, with no window manager decorations visible.  So Emacs is 
> not ignoring your window manager, it is your window manager who does all 
> the work and has descided that this is what fullscreen shall look like.  
> If you don't like it, you have to file a bug on metacity.

Thanks for the explanation Jan. I guess I am looking for some 
semi-fullscreen option.

>> Starting an Emacs session with
>>
>> /usr/local/emacs/bin/emacs --no-site-file -Q -fs
>>
>> results in the error described above (Emacs takes up the complete X: 
>> no panels, not even the toolbar, is displayed).
> 
> Do you mean that the Emacs toolbar dissapears?  That would be a bug.

Sorry, this was wrong (see my other message). The Emacs toolbar is 
displayed correctly.

Patrick