From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Paul Eggert Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: tarball builds Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2016 10:58:00 -0700 Organization: UCLA Computer Science Department Message-ID: References: <87twe57lmn.fsf@xi.bootis> <45fb742d-0121-3588-e87d-3a80c9d1d056@cs.ucla.edu> <582be31a-5eb6-55a0-8cb0-940058ec631f@cs.ucla.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1472579902 6965 195.159.176.226 (30 Aug 2016 17:58:22 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2016 17:58:22 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.2.0 Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Stefan Monnier Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Aug 30 19:58:18 2016 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1benIg-0001R2-Ip for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 30 Aug 2016 19:58:18 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:50557 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1benIe-0005yw-8r for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 30 Aug 2016 13:58:16 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:58899) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1benIW-0005ya-7n for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 30 Aug 2016 13:58:09 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1benIR-0000eb-TV for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 30 Aug 2016 13:58:07 -0400 Original-Received: from zimbra.cs.ucla.edu ([131.179.128.68]:42836) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1benIR-0000eT-OQ for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 30 Aug 2016 13:58:03 -0400 Original-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zimbra.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1740B16137A; Tue, 30 Aug 2016 10:58:02 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from zimbra.cs.ucla.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (zimbra.cs.ucla.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10032) with ESMTP id VJhCwxmpPelb; Tue, 30 Aug 2016 10:58:01 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zimbra.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4B87016137C; Tue, 30 Aug 2016 10:58:01 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at zimbra.cs.ucla.edu Original-Received: from zimbra.cs.ucla.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (zimbra.cs.ucla.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10026) with ESMTP id BeLu__iejPWp; Tue, 30 Aug 2016 10:58:01 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from [192.168.1.9] (unknown [100.32.155.148]) by zimbra.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 2EF1116137A; Tue, 30 Aug 2016 10:58:01 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x X-Received-From: 131.179.128.68 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:206983 Archived-At: Stefan Monnier wrote: >>> I have the impression that the same holds for Mac OS X and for Window= s >> I don't use either OS, but I do still use Solaris 10 and the default >> installs on Solaris 10 (which is still shipping!) lack many developer = tools >> like Autoconf. > > But does it come with the other things we require (libgnutls, libpng, .= ..)? No. > If not, what steps are usually used to bring those dependencies? I usually just configure --without-gnutls, etc. > If they're usually brought from some kind of package management system > like Fink/Macports/APT/RPM then adding more dependencies shouldn't make > much difference. I often deal with systems where those packages must be installed by peopl= e with=20 superuser privileges, which I lack. Sure, I can (and do) ask admins to in= stall=20 or upgrade stuff, but there's often a delay involved. The delays can ofte= n=20 stretch for months, due to concerns that the changes may negatively affec= t other=20 users. (That's life in the big-bureaucracy world....) Also, traditional platforms like Solaris 10 don't have some of those pack= ages,=20 even as options. So as a user I would have to build and install them myse= lf,=20 which would be an obstacle. > For GNU/Linux, as mentioned, compiling the latest is easy because you > just need a single command to bring in all the needed packages (no > matter how many there are). If only things were that simple! Unfortunately: 1. The "single command" is distribution-dependent. You'd need a different= =20 command on Debian vs Fedora vs etc., and you might even need a different = command=20 on Fedora 23 vs Fedora 24. This sort of thing is OK for the Debian, Fedor= a, etc.=20 distributors (they can maintain their prebuild scripts themselves) but it= would=20 be painful for us to maintain all this stuff upstream. 2. The needed developer packages can sometimes conflict. Just last week I= ran=20 into such a problem on Fedora 24 where the x86-64 and x86 packages confli= cted=20 with each other and I was thrust into dependency hell. I regularly run in= to such=20 problems on Fedora, and it's understandable because developer package=20 dependencies are not debugged as thoroughly.