From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Miles Bader Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Gtk scrollbar: thumb too short Date: 02 Apr 2003 10:39:53 +0900 Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Message-ID: References: <20030325193739.ZGIN3924.fep01-svc.swip.net@gaffa.gaia.swipnet.se> <3E8345E8.4090509@swipnet.se> <1048872463.17161.132.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1049134327.3326.74.camel@localhost.localdomain> <200304010028.h310Sm210574@eel.dms.auburn.edu> <1049219327.16663.81.camel@localhost.localdomain> Reply-To: Miles Bader NNTP-Posting-Host: main.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: main.gmane.org 1049247907 32146 80.91.224.249 (2 Apr 2003 01:45:07 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@main.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 01:45:07 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Wed Apr 02 03:45:03 2003 Return-path: Original-Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([80.91.224.244]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 190XJH-0008M9-00 for ; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 03:45:03 +0200 Original-Received: from monty-python.gnu.org ([199.232.76.173]) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 190XK8-0000e1-00 for ; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 03:45:56 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.10.13) id 190XJE-0001Ey-03 for emacs-devel@quimby.gnus.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 20:45:00 -0500 Original-Received: from list by monty-python.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.10.13) id 190XIq-00014a-00 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 20:44:36 -0500 Original-Received: from mail by monty-python.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.10.13) id 190XHb-0006uR-00 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 20:43:20 -0500 Original-Received: from tyo201.gate.nec.co.jp ([210.143.35.51]) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.10.13) id 190XGD-0005UZ-00; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 20:41:53 -0500 Original-Received: from mailgate3.nec.co.jp ([10.7.69.194])h321fWw19165; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 10:41:32 +0900 (JST) Original-Received: (from root@localhost) by mailgate3.nec.co.jp (8.11.6/3.7W-MAILGATE-NEC) id h321fVv16151; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 10:41:31 +0900 (JST) Original-Received: from edsgm02.lsi.nec.co.jp ([10.50.208.12]) by mailsv.nec.co.jp (8.11.6/3.7W-MAILSV-NEC) with ESMTP id h321dv903174; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 10:41:24 +0900 (JST) Original-Received: from mcsss2.ucom.lsi.nec.co.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) KAA22602; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 10:39:56 +0900 (JST) Original-Received: from mcspd15.ucom.lsi.nec.co.jp (mcspd15 [10.30.114.174]) with ESMTP id h321dsNH002171; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 10:39:55 +0900 (JST) Original-Received: by mcspd15.ucom.lsi.nec.co.jp (Postfix, from userid 31295) id CEEBF3724; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 10:39:53 +0900 (JST) Original-To: Owen Taylor System-Type: i686-pc-linux-gnu Blat: Foop In-Reply-To: <1049219327.16663.81.camel@localhost.localdomain> Original-Lines: 19 Original-cc: rms@gnu.org Original-cc: Luc Teirlinck Original-cc: jan.h.d@swipnet.se Original-cc: kai.grossjohann@uni-duisburg.de X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1b5 Precedence: list List-Id: Emacs development discussions. List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: List-Unsubscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+emacs-devel=quimby.gnus.org@gnu.org Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:12826 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel:12826 Owen Taylor writes: > If the scrollbar occupies the entire scrollbar trough, dragging it > downward doesn't correspond to any physical motion of a scrollbar > thumb. If you want that mouse action to be possible, I'd argue that > you really shouldn't use a control that looks like it has real > physical presence - something like the Emacs native scrollbar is more > correct. That might be an argument if the desired emacs behavior was somehow totally bizarre -- but it's not, it merely pushes the boundaries a bit beyond what other GTK apps do. There are various ways to think of the suggested behavior (such as pushing the bar into a hole in the end or something), but the basic point is that it _feels_ natural and `plausible'; it doesn't break the illusion of manipulating a physical thing, as you claim. -Miles -- Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum viditur.