From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: Dmitry Gutov Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: A prototype for a binding based approach to proper namespaces Date: Sat, 9 May 2020 21:55:05 +0300 Message-ID: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="22680"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.7.0 To: Helmut Eller , emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sat May 09 20:55:43 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jXUdS-0005nW-SQ for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 09 May 2020 20:55:42 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:41064 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jXUdR-0004ex-El for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sat, 09 May 2020 14:55:41 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:44370) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jXUcw-00049H-Ci for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 09 May 2020 14:55:10 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-wm1-x333.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::333]:35267) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jXUcu-0001M3-UX for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 09 May 2020 14:55:10 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-wm1-x333.google.com with SMTP id r26so14276538wmh.0 for ; Sat, 09 May 2020 11:55:08 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=sender:subject:to:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=3d+4R5a1h/36gu80Rtof4ogHBnwtrh2gusa7/Tu3f5w=; b=rbgfSBT1xJ+LujMUhPrbUB1FFpl8zV22Iw/RfU08A0EvLdFiuS6muexvQr63y8z1G3 cJnnH3RGU5Kh27cv2/qINodpV6Ul7i+f8ZA7+eNrFLGcvstsgg0dnOa+UgGEL2kGaiBJ SnQHI9uX33RfoBp9kV6nOKYTz0rtegsM2Rip+JpktQ78EIBePHoUcgw+4kZDavrmEvuC NbY9jhViZwwqrL7rkhmG0KwKYpY7k7npclms62j9z7S34y1RWborbpJKe8y1CoVpfzYe E7u+Jc8eO9J1Ct3/mUfluTc/pytCrRS3HKNPNKneVXM4jPsWh5M6piKAS0aY/IyKub4w yBsw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:sender:subject:to:references:from:message-id :date:user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language :content-transfer-encoding; bh=3d+4R5a1h/36gu80Rtof4ogHBnwtrh2gusa7/Tu3f5w=; b=itinzyOloZLI4cmt2CEzNI1HLFtTQubyokeWoh+6wpUmaF6JDIc6GmefdqVi72XdXe vCJdnfh3grBE0HLRM+2oTe3HWBtOWum4LWbY5PmXsE+Hk1a7NhZfOr1wAgteEunhWSRZ z+zH+P6YI63VibGcF7y68t7psSBBkFTfXthzSK4alFQNaaxwxKnfl2sniCs8JP6Vc1xe hzFtzIPSHvj2YkzMwH2TCMwUd9EJTt6A+TA0LbCSRD6nt+2rLWLP8psikVm0RDe+bHub OJ5ZZKRyXF8Y1EMQuMGQdRvape8xz34zCN1mSguDsibvn0IDp0L9I990tmc8xEgZ6eYE watQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AGi0PuZI58D91IfUjINzvvynqbfSTcP/Schzw+/L0OB4ciCYY2HmQM/j TE8kTx1TAggMY6/lH6FdM//RCy+p X-Google-Smtp-Source: APiQypLEo5v2M/WeQa5XnAgWVSmhrwSYfGOrM58s3txr6kSFpe+ckip3gt/uxhGAirKs4oQvOmMZpA== X-Received: by 2002:a7b:cc0e:: with SMTP id f14mr22499210wmh.39.1589050507011; Sat, 09 May 2020 11:55:07 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from [192.168.0.3] ([66.205.73.129]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id u16sm9338121wrq.17.2020.05.09.11.55.05 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 09 May 2020 11:55:06 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: Content-Language: en-US Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::333; envelope-from=raaahh@gmail.com; helo=mail-wm1-x333.google.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: No matching host in p0f cache. That's all we know. X-Spam_score_int: -16 X-Spam_score: -1.7 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.7 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.001, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.249, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001 autolearn=_AUTOLEARN X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:249551 Archived-At: On 09.05.2020 21:08, Helmut Eller wrote: >> On 09.05.2020 10:38, Helmut Eller wrote: >>> Of course, to be useful it would need a be shorter name or even be a >>> reader macro like #'. >> >> FWIW, Clojure tries to solve this problem by having ` return >> fully-qualified symbols: >> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/17800917/clojure-difference-between-apostrophe-and-backtick >> >> ' returns "unqualified ones", and can be used inside ` forms to create >> "unqualified" elements in there. > > Interesting. It's certainly useful to be able to write down lists > etc. that contain many symbols. In Emacs we would probably not change > the existing backquote, but instead use something new like #`. I don't know. It could. I imagine the backward compatibility argument would not exactly apply, given that the change would only affect code using the new namespaces system. > It seems[1] that in Clojure the symbol is resolved at read-time. I'm > not sure that that is better than resolving it at macroexpand-time or > compile-time. Can't comment on that. > Helmut > > [1] https://clojure.org/reference/reader#syntax-quote > >