From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Troy Hinckley Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Consideration for Rust contributions in Emacs Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2023 15:48:28 -0700 Message-ID: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="63cc6bc1_7de67713_4fe" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="7365"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun Jan 22 06:54:40 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1pJTJP-0001kN-7B for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 22 Jan 2023 06:54:39 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pJTIh-0000CU-UY; Sun, 22 Jan 2023 00:53:56 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pJMfG-0001sw-CI for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 21 Jan 2023 17:48:46 -0500 Original-Received: from sender4-op-o16.zoho.com ([136.143.188.16]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1pJMfE-0006KT-L0 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 21 Jan 2023 17:48:46 -0500 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; t=1674341320; cv=none; d=zohomail.com; s=zohoarc; b=XaeLxutCgOB2R5HYkiSOTBXAqO5eegI7h5AWaNTY3DgaEQUAePrUYkAQ++cUusHko2HOBWgo0FqEZ5MTtoC30vfibsT9+to2wVjLKu8HyIUmvP8zNSSBBjojypF9LiXvNKCzEJycOjQ+kn73FRwRN5Pyn7zBaqq35P0KEjdate4= ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=zohomail.com; s=zohoarc; t=1674341320; h=Content-Type:Date:From:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Message-ID:References:Subject:To; bh=U1BwLjpCCuFRJAoUlFrnbzD6YudTaG0hNu6O4+7fdC0=; b=fNgqkL7Ai3a7ry2HkrO6K/Qchz8lPxT4TTeijKMPzX0DFjC/Ivni1OIsGr7bam+kasaMuSeyzDCrWQSvrtcCjN9QuMNMbsQo366ECfBg7QVKimo6JQ6znBXjZVuvORv7YBhQP/UIooHKfb4QIzX0Jj+1WJKdUDPJlKXPwGSVFSI= ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.zohomail.com; dkim=pass header.i=dabrev.com; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=comms@dabrev.com; dmarc=pass header.from= DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; t=1674341320; s=zoho; d=dabrev.com; i=comms@dabrev.com; h=Date:Date:From:From:To:To:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:References:Subject:Subject:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Message-Id:Reply-To:Cc; bh=U1BwLjpCCuFRJAoUlFrnbzD6YudTaG0hNu6O4+7fdC0=; b=Kt79i+a7uoboW7MgzD4MJNg6SqbYejLjRGS+jycZF20FMLQqAR/qSaBZfkhVYtqB xSTgxnUcwrdNhWvBhRtoNlR8bXvAV5SS0MsSiB57MbbQVppiktMwWfSmKcEduQLC9/b AAr1O7tRwk2wZM7ces3QrOyenw1sgKsrj0ecVpzQ= Original-Received: from [192.168.1.122] (h24-54-181-16.ftcmco.broadband.dynamic.tds.net [24.54.181.16]) by mx.zohomail.com with SMTPS id 1674341317082872.3963582564501; Sat, 21 Jan 2023 14:48:37 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: X-Readdle-Message-ID: b972c046-8c29-42eb-92c9-0d5b5fe03551@Spark X-ZohoMailClient: External Received-SPF: pass client-ip=136.143.188.16; envelope-from=comms@dabrev.com; helo=sender4-op-o16.zoho.com X-Spam_score_int: -7 X-Spam_score: -0.8 X-Spam_bar: / X-Spam_report: (-0.8 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_BL_SPAMCOP_NET=1.347, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sun, 22 Jan 2023 00:53:54 -0500 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:302595 Archived-At: --63cc6bc1_7de67713_4fe Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline I've had a discussion with several people recently about future possibili= ties of Rust in GNU Emacs core. I could not find an answer to this on the= archives, so if it has been resolved previously please point me to that = thread. Let assume for the sake of this discussion that there was a some Rust cod= e that someone wanted to contribute and the maintainers wanted the functi= onality it provided. What would be the consideration/objections=3F Here a= re few that we came up with: 1. The Rust tool-chain is Apache licensed and so is LLVM. There is work o= n a=C2=A0GCC backend, but it is not production ready yet. Would Emacs all= ow the current Rust tool-chain=3F 2. LLVM (and hence Rust) support fewer targets than GCC. Are there certai= n target that LLVM doesn=E2=80=99t support that are important to Emacs=3F= 3. Many Rust libraries (crates) are MIT and/or Apache licensed. Do all Li= braries used by GNU Emacs need to be GPL or is it sufficient to have a GP= L compatible license=3F 4. How sizable of a contribution would be needed for the maintainers to a= ccept Rust in Emacs core=3F Would auxiliary functionality be considered (= such as Rust in the Linux Kernel) or would it need to have major impact. 5. Concerns over having more than one core language in GNU Emacs. 6. Concerns over using such a new language. Rust still changes at a fast = pace relative to C and it=E2=80=99s future is less certain then a more es= tablished language. 7. Concerns over support for Rust being a distraction from other developm= ent work. 8. I assume that =46S=46 copyright would still be a requirement. I just b= ring it up so no one else has to. Sincerely, Troy Hinckley --63cc6bc1_7de67713_4fe Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline
I've had a discussion with several people recently = about future possibilities of Rust in GNU Emacs core. I could not find an= answer to this on the archives, so if it has been resolved previously pl= ease point me to that thread.&=23160;

Let assume for the sake of this discussion that there was a some Rust cod= e that someone wanted to contribute and the maintainers wanted the functi= onality it provided. What would be the consideration/objections=3F Here a= re few that we came up with:
  1. The Rust tool-chain is Apache licensed and so is LLVM. There is work = on a&=23160;GCC backend, but it is not production ready yet. Would Emacs a= llow the current Rust tool-chain=3F
  2. LLVM (and hence Rust) support fewer targets than GCC. Are there certa= in target that LLVM doesn=E2=80=99t support that are important to Emacs=3F=
  3. Many Rust libraries (crates) are MIT and/or Apache licensed. Do all L= ibraries used by GNU Emacs need to be GPL or is it sufficient to have a G= PL compatible license=3F
  4. How sizable of a contribution would be needed for the maintainers to = accept Rust in Emacs core=3F Would auxiliary functionality be considered = (such as Rust in the Linux Kernel) or would it need to have major impact.=
  5. Concerns over having more than one core language in GNU Emacs.
  6. Concerns over using such a new language. Rust still changes at a fast= pace relative to C and it=E2=80=99s future is less certain then a more e= stablished language.
  7. Concerns over support for Rust being a distraction from other develop= ment work.
  8. I assume that =46S=46 copyright would still be a requirement. I just = bring it up so no one else has to.

Sincerely,
Troy Hinckley
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