From: Gregory Heytings via "Emacs development discussions." <emacs-devel@gnu.org>
To: Alan Mackenzie <acm@muc.de>
Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org
Subject: Re: Confused by y-or-n-p
Date: Mon, 04 Jan 2021 13:10:33 +0000 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <alpine.NEB.2.22.394.2101041336320453.26968@sdf.lonestar.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <X/MLcO+6f3uYr1nm@ACM>
>> I haven't seen a single argument in that thread to remove the current
>> behavior. I've only seen an argument that you (and only you AFAICS)
>> don't like it.
>
> I suggest you reread that thread, long though it is, with some care.
> There were strong arguments expressed there, for improving the then
> current behaviour.
>
There are arguments to _improve_ the current behavior, that is, to provide
other behaviors, and I agree with these arguments. But there are no
arguments to _remove_ the current behavior, which should either remain the
default or be available by setting a variable.
>
> Forgive me if I become uncustomarily blunt and personal, but it seems
> you are determined to find the worst possible interpretation of
> everything, and your replies to so many posts take on an unusually
> negative tone.
>
That was not at all my intention, I'm sorry if you have perceived it as
such.
>
> Would you please try to be more positive in your posts, and try to work
> together with people to achieve goals, rather than antagonising them.
> Thanks!
>
I believe that's what I did, I initially pointed you the difference
between the use of the echo area and the minibuffer inside isearch, I gave
you a number of possible improved behaviors, and I already spend quite
some time testing your patch and providing you with feedback. I don't
think this can be considered as an "antagonising" behavior.
>
> I don't really want to get drawn here into detailled discussion which
> really belongs on that other thread, but would point out that that
> "longstanding behaviour" which you seem so attached to appears to be an
> ad hoc unsystematic mess resulting from a lack of systematic attention.
> [...]
> The old "behaviour" seems to be an ad hoc unsystematic mess, not worthy
> even of being called a behaviour.
>
These are very strong statements. I understand that this is what it seems
to you, and I would even say that to a certain extent I agree with you,
but again, you don't know whether others rely on what you consider to be a
mess in their libraries or configurations.
>> But the problem is that I am now, and everybody else is now, in a
>> situation where we have to spend a lot of time testing various
>> combinations of commands and to describe what doesn't work anymore,
>> which inevitably leads to very long and boring mails and discussions.
>
> How is that a problem? Nobody is forcing you into such discussions.
> At the cutting edge of development, there are bound to be new things,
> there are bound to be old things let go, and there are bound to be
> controversies. That is the very essence of development. People are
> grateful for the feedback you give, but nobody is forcing you into doing
> anything.
>
I don't feel forced to do anything. I was only pointing the fact that
those who object the removal of a behavior are in a position that their
feedback will look like bikeshedding. This would not happen if the old
behavior remained available; the discussion would then be more
constructive, around the question "what is the best default behavior".
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2021-01-04 13:10 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 210+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2020-12-23 15:24 Confused by y-or-n-p Eli Zaretskii
2020-12-23 16:45 ` Stefan Monnier
2020-12-23 17:04 ` Jean Louis
2020-12-23 17:35 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-12-23 18:11 ` Stefan Monnier
2020-12-23 18:44 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-12-25 4:29 ` Richard Stallman
2020-12-23 19:48 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2020-12-23 19:53 ` Karl Fogel
2020-12-23 20:27 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-12-24 18:26 ` Karl Fogel
2020-12-24 5:56 ` Richard Stallman
2020-12-24 5:53 ` Richard Stallman
2020-12-24 6:06 ` David Masterson
2020-12-24 16:49 ` João Távora
2020-12-24 15:38 ` martin rudalics
2020-12-24 20:47 ` Juri Linkov
2020-12-25 7:23 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-12-25 9:07 ` martin rudalics
2020-12-25 11:32 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-12-25 13:20 ` martin rudalics
2020-12-26 10:24 ` Richard Stallman
2020-12-26 11:01 ` Jean Louis
2020-12-26 13:41 ` martin rudalics
2020-12-27 16:25 ` Juri Linkov
2020-12-27 17:16 ` martin rudalics
2020-12-28 8:48 ` Juri Linkov
2020-12-27 18:06 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-12-28 8:52 ` Juri Linkov
2020-12-28 9:36 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-12-28 17:06 ` Juri Linkov
2020-12-28 17:28 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-12-30 9:54 ` Juri Linkov
2021-01-02 5:25 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-02 13:36 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-02 5:25 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-02 5:25 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-02 7:06 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-02 7:22 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-01-02 17:06 ` Drew Adams
2021-01-02 17:14 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-03 6:06 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-03 15:16 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-04 5:16 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-04 6:10 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-01-04 7:54 ` Stefan Kangas
2021-01-04 9:21 ` martin rudalics
2021-01-04 9:24 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-01-04 9:55 ` martin rudalics
2021-01-04 11:28 ` Andrea Corallo via Emacs development discussions.
2021-01-04 14:58 ` Dmitry Gutov
2021-01-04 15:09 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-04 15:17 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-01-04 16:10 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-05 8:16 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-01-05 15:03 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-06 5:01 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-06 15:19 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-04 17:17 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-01-04 17:43 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-04 18:02 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-01-04 18:15 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-05 8:32 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-01-06 5:02 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-06 15:20 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-06 16:44 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-01-06 17:05 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-06 17:13 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-01-04 17:20 ` martin rudalics
2021-01-04 17:43 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-01-04 18:52 ` martin rudalics
2021-01-05 8:33 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-01-04 18:04 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-01-06 5:03 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-06 15:23 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-07 7:53 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-06 5:01 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-04 17:53 ` Juri Linkov
2021-01-05 6:33 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-05 14:57 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-05 6:35 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-04 10:28 ` Gregory Heytings via Emacs development discussions.
2021-01-04 17:22 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-01-04 17:28 ` martin rudalics
2021-01-06 5:03 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-04 22:18 ` Gregory Heytings via Emacs development discussions.
2021-01-05 14:50 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-06 0:14 ` Gregory Heytings via Emacs development discussions.
2021-01-06 3:34 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-06 9:41 ` Gregory Heytings via Emacs development discussions.
2021-01-06 15:33 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-06 15:46 ` Tassilo Horn
2021-01-06 16:08 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-06 16:36 ` Tassilo Horn
2021-01-06 16:58 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-06 23:57 ` Gregory Heytings via Emacs development discussions.
2021-01-07 9:41 ` Stefan Kangas
2021-01-08 6:17 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-07 7:41 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-07 14:23 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-13 15:57 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-06 5:13 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-05 6:29 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-04 8:52 ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2021-01-05 6:33 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-05 14:44 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-01-07 7:33 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-07 14:18 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-07 15:09 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-01-13 15:57 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-13 16:16 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-15 5:28 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-15 7:13 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-17 6:03 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-07 15:10 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-01-05 14:58 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-04 14:59 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-06 5:01 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-06 15:16 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-06 21:18 ` Alfred M. Szmidt
2021-01-07 3:32 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-06 15:28 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-01-06 5:01 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-06 15:17 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-04 5:17 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-04 6:12 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-01-04 15:01 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-06 5:01 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-06 15:14 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-06 5:01 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-06 15:16 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-07 7:53 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-07 14:32 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-04 10:28 ` Gregory Heytings via Emacs development discussions.
2021-01-04 11:02 ` Alan Mackenzie
2021-01-04 11:35 ` Gregory Heytings via Emacs development discussions.
2021-01-04 12:34 ` Alan Mackenzie
2021-01-04 13:10 ` Gregory Heytings via Emacs development discussions. [this message]
2021-01-04 17:21 ` martin rudalics
2021-01-05 10:48 ` Alan Mackenzie
2021-01-05 11:10 ` tomas
2021-01-05 15:34 ` martin rudalics
2021-01-04 15:19 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-04 22:17 ` Gregory Heytings via Emacs development discussions.
2021-01-05 11:44 ` Alan Mackenzie
2021-01-05 14:48 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-05 18:18 ` Juri Linkov
2021-01-05 6:44 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-03 6:01 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-03 6:01 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-04 18:03 ` Juri Linkov
2021-01-06 5:03 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-14 8:50 ` Juri Linkov
2021-01-15 5:41 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-03 6:03 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-03 15:13 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-05 6:25 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-05 14:54 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-06 0:14 ` Gregory Heytings via Emacs development discussions.
2021-01-06 0:44 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-01-06 9:41 ` Gregory Heytings via Emacs development discussions.
2021-01-06 11:06 ` Stefan Kangas
2021-01-06 15:35 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-06 15:46 ` Drew Adams
2021-01-06 23:57 ` Gregory Heytings via Emacs development discussions.
2021-01-07 9:46 ` Stefan Kangas
2021-01-07 10:03 ` Gregory Heytings via Emacs development discussions.
2021-01-07 10:29 ` Stefan Kangas
2021-01-09 6:34 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-09 8:32 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-09 14:06 ` Following etc/NEWS on the development branch (was: Confused by y-or-n-p) Kévin Le Gouguec
2021-01-09 14:24 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-09 16:05 ` Following etc/NEWS on the development branch Kévin Le Gouguec
2021-01-09 9:34 ` Confused by y-or-n-p Gregory Heytings via Emacs development discussions.
2021-01-10 6:07 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-07 14:09 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-07 23:34 ` Gregory Heytings via Emacs development discussions.
2021-01-08 2:10 ` Stefan Monnier
2021-01-09 9:34 ` Gregory Heytings via Emacs development discussions.
2021-01-08 7:16 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-09 6:44 ` Stealing minibuffers [Was: Confused by y-or-n-p] Richard Stallman
2021-01-09 9:34 ` Gregory Heytings via Emacs development discussions.
2021-01-09 10:04 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-06 15:32 ` Confused by y-or-n-p Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-07 7:52 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-07 14:27 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-01-07 7:52 ` Richard Stallman
2021-01-06 3:35 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-12-28 5:26 ` Richard Stallman
2020-12-28 5:51 ` Drew Adams
2020-12-28 8:59 ` Juri Linkov
2020-12-26 10:24 ` Richard Stallman
2020-12-26 10:51 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-12-27 5:38 ` Richard Stallman
2020-12-25 9:23 ` Juri Linkov
2020-12-25 11:46 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-12-25 8:42 ` martin rudalics
2020-12-25 11:31 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-12-25 13:20 ` martin rudalics
2020-12-26 10:24 ` Richard Stallman
2020-12-26 10:41 ` Sv: " arthur miller
2020-12-27 5:38 ` Richard Stallman
2020-12-26 10:49 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-12-26 13:45 ` martin rudalics
2020-12-27 5:46 ` Richard Stallman
2020-12-26 18:30 ` Drew Adams
2020-12-25 4:40 ` Richard Stallman
2020-12-25 8:42 ` martin rudalics
2020-12-28 17:09 ` Juri Linkov
2020-12-29 8:53 ` martin rudalics
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