From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Ben Wing Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: C-l while in menu? Date: Wed, 24 Apr 2002 03:56:23 -0700 Sender: emacs-devel-admin@gnu.org Message-ID: References: NNTP-Posting-Host: localhost.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------070405080505070208050000" X-Trace: main.gmane.org 1019646914 935 127.0.0.1 (24 Apr 2002 11:15:14 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@main.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 24 Apr 2002 11:15:14 +0000 (UTC) Cc: "Kim F. Storm" , Miles Bader ,Pavel =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jan=EDk?= ,Stefan Monnier ,Richard Stallman , gerd@gnu.org,emacs-devel@gnu.org, xemacs-design@xemacs.org Return-path: Original-Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([80.91.224.244]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1 (Debian)) id 170Kjy-0000Ey-00 for ; Wed, 24 Apr 2002 13:15:14 +0200 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([199.232.76.164]) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 170Klc-00009T-00 for ; Wed, 24 Apr 2002 13:16:56 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=fencepost.gnu.org) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 3.34 #1 (Debian)) id 170KSg-0002o0-00; Wed, 24 Apr 2002 06:57:22 -0400 Original-Received: from harrier.mail.pas.earthlink.net ([207.217.120.12] helo=harrier.prod.itd.earthlink.net) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 3.34 #1 (Debian)) id 170KQI-0002bk-00; Wed, 24 Apr 2002 06:54:54 -0400 Original-Received: from sdn-ap-007caburbp1726.dialsprint.net ([63.184.70.202] helo=666.com) by harrier.prod.itd.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #2) id 170KQ3-0004GK-00; Wed, 24 Apr 2002 03:54:39 -0700 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020314 Netscape6/6.2.2 X-Accept-Language: en-us Original-To: Simon Josefsson Errors-To: emacs-devel-admin@gnu.org X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.9 Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Id: Emacs development discussions. List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:3175 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel:3175 --------------070405080505070208050000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Simon Josefsson wrote: >On 23 Apr 2002, Kim F. Storm wrote: > >>On the other hand, I think many new users would expect that M-f would >>open the File menu, and since he doesn't already know that M-f runs >>forward-word, he'll probably never be bothered with having to use S-M-f >>to invoke that command. >> > >People will probably only expect accelerators to work if, e.g., the F in >File was underlined. > In XEmacs, they are. In an earlier message, which was ignored, I suggested that you guys actually run XEmacs to see how it works. I'm not sure why there's so much resistance to doing this -- I can't really see how this would infringe on RMS's directive not to look directly at XEmacs code. I really want to see greater compatibility between GNU Emacs and XEmacs. But that can't happen unless each side explores on its own what the other side has [btw I personally spend a fair amount of time looking at GNU Emacs source code to try to maintain compatibility]. It's not enough to ask a developer on the other side or wait for them to tell you what's out there; also, it uses up time on their part. I would like to see general agreement that we will try to work more closely in keeping new interfaces compatible whenever possible. Every new interface that's incompatible moves us farther away from the ultimate goal of unifying the interfaces, which I think most of us agree on (I certainly do). If people have problems getting XEmacs to compile or run on their platform, or they have problems with the pre-built binaries that exist for many platforms, I'll be glad to help out in getting them working. ben --------------070405080505070208050000 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Simon Josefsson wrote:
On 23 Apr 2002, Kim F. Storm wrote:

On the other hand, I think many new users would expect that M-f would
open the File menu, and since he doesn't already know that M-f runs
forward-word, he'll probably never be bothered with having to use S-M-f
to invoke that command.

People will probably only expect accelerators to work if, e.g., the F in 
File was underlined.

In XEmacs, they are.


In an earlier message, which was ignored, I suggested that you guys actually run XEmacs to see how it works.  I'm not sure why there's so much resistance to doing this -- I can't really see how this would infringe on RMS's directive not to look directly at XEmacs code.

I really want to see greater compatibility between GNU Emacs and XEmacs.  But that can't happen unless each side explores on its own what the other side has [btw I personally spend a fair amount of time looking at GNU Emacs source code to try to maintain compatibility].  It's not enough to ask a developer on the other side or wait for them to tell you what's out there; also, it uses up time on their part.

I would like to see general agreement that we will try to work more closely in keeping new interfaces compatible whenever possible.  Every new interface that's incompatible moves us farther away from the ultimate goal of unifying the interfaces, which I think most of us agree on (I certainly do).

If people have problems getting XEmacs to compile or run on their platform, or they have problems with the pre-built binaries that exist for many platforms, I'll be glad to help out in getting them working.


ben
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