From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Rajesh Vaidheeswarran" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Whitespace cleanup, tab-width and religion. Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 20:55:48 -0500 Message-ID: References: <87fybafyis.fsf@lrde.org> <87slfaeh5z.fsf@lrde.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1414458974==" X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1167962178 24851 80.91.229.12 (5 Jan 2007 01:56:18 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 01:56:18 +0000 (UTC) Cc: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Micha=EBl_Cadilhac?= , emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Jan 05 02:56:16 2007 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1H2eJR-0005BL-J9 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 02:56:06 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2eJQ-0003qx-SO for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 20:56:04 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1H2eJD-0003p9-MF for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 20:55:51 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1H2eJC-0003mh-5u for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 20:55:51 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2eJB-0003mK-Vy for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 20:55:50 -0500 Original-Received: from [64.233.184.231] (helo=wr-out-0506.google.com) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1H2eJB-00082J-04 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 20:55:49 -0500 Original-Received: by wr-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id i30so1294944wra for ; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 17:55:48 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:sender:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references:x-google-sender-auth; b=KvcfTYQGbI7zV1Sbe3LF8w64VthGuCYthTTLlXh0RpVF4sbNDCKS7xGh9mTNhGFiHCYipuJgbSu65XrHdaK6ak2rUubkUardq7/6Ob7oK/u67V+0qCZRH7Zrn11QakaMOA2MIZt8mqNu/ADCagE3cudpfxIkqakqCk9RT46a/NQ= Original-Received: by 10.90.68.15 with SMTP id q15mr656121aga.1167962148135; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 17:55:48 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: by 10.90.66.6 with HTTP; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 17:55:48 -0800 (PST) Original-To: "Kim F. Storm" In-Reply-To: X-Google-Sender-Auth: d9233d1cbafb9f41 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:64805 Archived-At: --===============1414458974== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_27511_18862634.1167962148103" ------=_Part_27511_18862634.1167962148103 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline On 1/2/07, Kim F. Storm wrote: > > "Rajesh Vaidheeswarran" writes: > > > > To be clear, from whitespace.el's point of view, it is not relevant wha= t > the > > tab-width is set at. People set tab-widths to whatever they please on > their > > favorite editors. > > favorite editor_s_ ? Isn't this an Emacs package? > > Shouldn't it _primarily_ work seamless with Emacs? If people need code to interoperate with other editors, they probably > shouldn't change tab-width -- but in the specific case, Micha=EBl actuall= y > need to change tab-width because of interoperability issues! > > So why make whitespace.el _enforce_ "standards" which are unnecessary at > best, and disruptive at worst. > I don't see it as religious -- tab-width exists, so it's reality, and > there's no need to turn it into a religious issue. [all three answered below] It is impractical to make statements like that. Every development organization has people who use different editors, and who operate on the same source files. Editing a file inside emacs, with whitespace enforcing TABs at tab-width other than 8 and printing or viewing that file via anothe= r mechanism will be inconsistent. This is why the library explains why this i= s religious. If it were not religious, we wouldn't be exchanging these mails in the first place. > Do you object that that change? yes. It works as designed and intended. ------=_Part_27511_18862634.1167962148103 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline

On 1/2/07, Kim F. Storm <storm@cua.dk> wrote:
rv@gnu.= org> writes:


> To be clear, from whitespace.el's point of view, it is not relevan= t what the
> tab-width is set at. People set tab-widths to whatever t= hey please on their
> favorite editors.

favorite editor_s_ ?&n= bsp;  Isn't this an Emacs package?

Shouldn't it _primarily_ work seamless with Emacs?
=
If people nee= d code to interoperate with other editors, they probably
shouldn't change tab-width -- but in the specific case, Micha=EBl a= ctually
need to change tab-width because of interoperability issues!
=
So why make whitespace.el _enforce_ "standards" which are unn= ecessary at
best, and disruptive at worst.


I don't see it as reli= gious -- tab-width exists, so it's reality, and
there's no need to turn it into a religious issue.


[all three answered below]

It is impractical to make statements like that. Every development organization has people who use different editors, and who operate on the same source files. Editing a file inside emacs, with whitespace enforci= ng TABs at tab-width other than 8 and printing or viewing that file via ano= ther mechanism will be inconsistent. This is why the library explains why t= his is religious. If it were not religious, we wouldn't be exchanging t= hese mails in the first place.
  


Do you object that that change?

 yes. It works as designed and intended.
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