From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Drew Adams Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: RE: delete-selection-mode as default Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2018 07:33:01 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: References: NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1536504372 23231 195.159.176.226 (9 Sep 2018 14:46:12 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2018 14:46:12 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: rms@gnu.org, Stefan Monnier Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sun Sep 09 16:46:07 2018 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1fz0yV-0005y2-9z for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 09 Sep 2018 16:46:07 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:47641 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fz10b-0004GD-Nx for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 09 Sep 2018 10:48:17 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:53787) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fz10P-0002Jx-Vc for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 09 Sep 2018 10:48:09 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fz0m1-0006eA-TS for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 09 Sep 2018 10:33:16 -0400 Original-Received: from aserp2120.oracle.com ([141.146.126.78]:35782) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1fz0m0-00064D-FP; Sun, 09 Sep 2018 10:33:13 -0400 Original-Received: from pps.filterd (aserp2120.oracle.com [127.0.0.1]) by aserp2120.oracle.com (8.16.0.22/8.16.0.22) with SMTP id w89EWp4X178582; Sun, 9 Sep 2018 14:33:10 GMT DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=oracle.com; h=mime-version : message-id : date : from : sender : to : cc : subject : references : in-reply-to : content-type : content-transfer-encoding; s=corp-2018-07-02; bh=Pul/ciUvZMRmjelS1vy4nDCEzzE/h5Awy/N0H6R2Dfk=; b=ttsT2xCKS2LVs9qLqENqDq+JLzMeaU45hlfOm9qwo5iKWmBNCpfyh8w7FOFw7uXxb+6o yfzVE2su3ftiip6a5+3pyibvcYHgdeuyl9Wiq6DnhM5rAUOViVCz/eTAesmD22nTNwRw eiGj5sBzvIOT13IKy5XffAPizNBsEjkCSB+zPCWz625V517d0bTMzeVpkuUPSDRAFY0V 0GAnO6Z0SEfEYVF4AmN2Z9kOxHiOHOWZUE4ZPo9Bsbmli4BRql9vuGtkBS4pCOdFIlt/ w2qUhrS2oaMvC8skyU459cuMKpue2X0v+tF4m5pp15dPNy0+gPfB6l+QqHi5re2XNggW 7Q== Original-Received: from userv0022.oracle.com (userv0022.oracle.com [156.151.31.74]) by aserp2120.oracle.com with ESMTP id 2mc6cpahqg-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 09 Sep 2018 14:33:09 +0000 Original-Received: from aserv0121.oracle.com (aserv0121.oracle.com [141.146.126.235]) by userv0022.oracle.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id w89EX3NJ018036 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 9 Sep 2018 14:33:03 GMT Original-Received: from abhmp0005.oracle.com (abhmp0005.oracle.com [141.146.116.11]) by aserv0121.oracle.com (8.14.4/8.13.8) with ESMTP id w89EX2tP004335; Sun, 9 Sep 2018 14:33:02 GMT In-Reply-To: X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.9.1 (1003210) [OL 16.0.4735.0 (x86)] X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=5900 definitions=9011 signatures=668708 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 suspectscore=0 malwarescore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 mlxscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-1807170000 definitions=main-1809090159 X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 141.146.126.78 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:229559 Archived-At: > > I think you take it for granted that the non-delete-selection-mode > > behavior of Emacs is fundamentally superior. >=20 > "Fundamentally" is not what I'm talking about. >=20 > delete-selection-mode is designed for the interface scheme where you > select a region with the mouse. That's where we copied it from. > In that interface scheme, delete-selection-mode fits. I can't speak to its history - that may be where you copied it from. But its design and its behavior fit just as well with selecting the region in any way, not just with a mouse. The region can be selected programmatically, by setting the mark and moving point interactively, using shift-selection, or any other method that might exist to select the region. > The traditional Emacs interface is that you edit with the > keyboard. What fits that interface is that Backspace deletes > one character. The traditional Emacs interface is defined how? Do you mean Emacs in a terminal? No faces? No mouse support? No text properties? How far back do you go, to find it? Or by traditional do you just mean the default behavior, which means of course that `d-s-m' is off? In any case, `d-s-m' works fine when editing with only the keyboard, with both keyboard and mouse, and with only the mouse (or foot pedals or...). Please don't suggest that `d-s-m' behavior is in some way limited to use with a mouse or that it in some way promotes or is connected with any particular OS (e.g. MS Windows) - it's not.