C-o (was: Proposal: new default bindings for winner and windmove)

C-o (was: Proposal: new default bindings for winner and windmove)

[Stefan Monnier]

>> I still think we need to find a better binding for C-o, FWIW.
[...]
>> What do you use it for?

I'm also curious to know how people use `C-o`, which I never ever use.

> What do you expect?  Opening a new line?

Not sure what answer Daniel was looking for, but for me at least the
question is about the "context" where you use `C-o`.  E.g. I can see
someone doing

    C-o foo bar

but I don't see the benefit compared to

    foo bar RET

It probably comes down to habit, but I'm hoping there's more to it
than that.


        Stefan

Re: C-o (was: Proposal: new default bindings for winner and windmove)

[Stefan Kangas]

Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> writes:

> Not sure what answer Daniel was looking for, but for me at least the
> question is about the "context" where you use `C-o`.  E.g. I can see
> someone doing
>
>     C-o foo bar
>
> but I don't see the benefit compared to
>
>     foo bar RET
>
> It probably comes down to habit, but I'm hoping there's more to it
> than that.

When I want to insert a new line above the current one, the easiest way
is two keys:

    C-a C-o

Without C-o, I'd need to use three keys:

    C-a RET <up>

I also use it to split lines and keep point at the current location.
For example, when in the middle of some line, I press

    C-o

Instead of

    RET <left>

It's minor, admittedly, but I'm so used to it that I'd miss it if I
didn't have it.  Vim has similar commands on o and O, IIRC.

Re: C-o (was: Proposal: new default bindings for winner and windmove)

[Per Starbäck]

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>
>  I can see
> someone doing
>
>     C-o foo bar
>
> but I don't see the benefit compared to
>
>     foo bar RET
>
> It probably comes down to habit, but I'm hoping there's more to it
> than that.
>

I have realized I want to add more text somewhere in the text:
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is the beginning of the text before the insertion. Here is the
end of the text, after the insertion.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Point is on "H" in "Here". Before typing the new text I do C-o to get the
continuation out of the way while typing. I wouldn't do that if I'm just
adding something short, but if I'm adding a longer text I would.
In programming I would also do that if adding something longer or something
complicated. It feels better to be at the end of the line when adding text
than to push text in front of you, which can look a bit disturbing,
especially if it is long enough to be broken over to the next line.

I guess this is mostly by habit, but I see at least some advantages of
entering text at the end of the line. Then it's easier to C-e back to point
of entry if I go back to revise something just written, and I can use the
special case of C-t  for quick fixing. Also pushing text in front of me
will be a problem for ispell-word and other commands that look up the
current word. I could make sure to position myself before a space to avoid
that problem, but that would be an extra step to make where just C-o is
simpler.

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C-o (was: Proposal: new default bindings for winner and windmove)

[Johan Myréen]

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>
> I can see someone doing C-o foo bar but I don't see the benefit compared
> to foo bar RET


The benefit is that C-o opens a new blank line to type on, instead of
prepending what you are writing to the pre-existing text on the line, which
I find very distracting. Also, I might want to do a quick edit to what I
have typed so far (maybe to fix a typo before I forget it's there), and
then return to add new text to the line. If I open a new blank line with
C-o, I just type C-e to continue typing, but if the line is still stringed
together with the old line, then finding the correct point is a pita.

Note that the vi editor also has not only one, but two "open line" commands
"o" and "O", for opening a line below and above the current line,
respectively.

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Re: C-o (was: Proposal: new default bindings for winner and windmove)

[Jean Louis]

* Johan Myréen <johan.myreen@gmail.com> [2024-07-03 22:33]:
> >
> > I can see someone doing C-o foo bar but I don't see the benefit compared
> > to foo bar RET
> 
> 
> The benefit is that C-o opens a new blank line to type on, instead of
> prepending what you are writing to the pre-existing text on the line, which
> I find very distracting. Also, I might want to do a quick edit to what I
> have typed so far (maybe to fix a typo before I forget it's there), and
> then return to add new text to the line. If I open a new blank line with
> C-o, I just type C-e to continue typing, but if the line is still stringed
> together with the old line, then finding the correct point is a pita.
> 
> Note that the vi editor also has not only one, but two "open line" commands
> "o" and "O", for opening a line below and above the current line,
> respectively.

Just confirming on the older thread, that I am frequently using C-o
and find it very useful as explained abve by Johan.

-- 
Jean

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Re: C-o (was: Proposal: new default bindings for winner and windmove)

[Emanuel Berg]

Jean Louis wrote:

>> Note that the vi editor also has not only one, but two
>>  "open line" commands "o" and "O", for opening a line below
>>  and above the current line, respectively.
>
> Just confirming on the older thread, that I am frequently
> using C-o and find it very useful as explained abve
> by Johan.

I also bind it to a bunch of keys.

As a prefix key, so I can do, e.g.

(keymap-global-set "C-o i" #'beginning-of-buffer)
(keymap-global-set "C-o k" #'end-of-buffer)

and many more.

See `define-prefix-command'.

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