From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Alan Mackenzie Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: sqlite3 Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2021 10:37:55 +0000 Message-ID: References: <878rwx8mdn.fsf@gnu.org> <87zgpdhw4d.fsf@yahoo.com> <2F63580E-FF58-45D0-9DBB-389ED64C0F11@mit.edu> <83v8zzw867.fsf@gnu.org> <87wnk7kkxp.fsf@red-bean.com> <837dc6j9ui.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="17601"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: luangruo@yahoo.com, qhong@mit.edu, rms@gnu.org, eric@ericabrahamsen.net, cesar.mena@gmail.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org, kfogel@red-bean.com To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Fri Dec 17 11:39:37 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1myAeH-0004Kf-JB for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 17 Dec 2021 11:39:37 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:58906 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1myAeE-00072N-NN for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 17 Dec 2021 05:39:35 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:39216) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1myAcy-0006LZ-Ef for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 17 Dec 2021 05:38:16 -0500 Original-Received: from colin.muc.de ([193.149.48.1]:19164 helo=mail.muc.de) by eggs.gnu.org with smtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1myAcv-0004MF-E7 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 17 Dec 2021 05:38:16 -0500 Original-Received: (qmail 78930 invoked by uid 3782); 17 Dec 2021 10:37:56 -0000 Original-Received: from acm.muc.de (p4fe154d4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [79.225.84.212]) (using STARTTLS) by colin.muc.de (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Fri, 17 Dec 2021 11:37:56 +0100 Original-Received: (qmail 6232 invoked by uid 1000); 17 Dec 2021 10:37:55 -0000 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <837dc6j9ui.fsf@gnu.org> X-Submission-Agent: TMDA/1.3.x (Ph3nix) X-Primary-Address: acm@muc.de Received-SPF: pass client-ip=193.149.48.1; envelope-from=acm@muc.de; helo=mail.muc.de X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:282205 Archived-At: Hello, Eli. On Wed, Dec 15, 2021 at 15:06:45 +0200, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > > Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2021 22:01:33 +0000 > > Cc: Eli Zaretskii , Qiantan Hong , rms@gnu.org, > > eric@ericabrahamsen.net, cesar.mena@gmail.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org, > > luangruo@yahoo.com > > From: Alan Mackenzie > > I question the wisdom of adding more inessential stuff to the Emacs core. > > To be perfectly blunt, it is bloat. > To be perfectly blunt, please leave that worry to Lars and myself. > That's why we are here, that's why we invest such an inordinate amount > of time working on Emacs (and on top of that, more time to participate > in this futile dispute). I'll keep this reply short. [ .... ] > > I feel sqlite has been added to the core, merged into master, with > > indecent haste, and without due reflection. > Your feelings are wrong, and disclosing them here is unfair. You have > no real evidence to back that up, and without that it is just an > unfounded accusation. Normally, potential new features spend more than just a few days on a git branch, allowing people the chance to try them out and spot any problems. That didn't happen with this new sqlite feature. [ .... ] > Frankly, I'm amazed at the bru-ha-ha this change triggered, and keep > being amazed each day anew. Who'd know that Emacs is such a > scandalous environment? This change potentially changes what Emacs _is_. Most changes don't do that. It came out of the blue and was integrated into master in a few days. I'd be surprised if a change like this didn't generate some amount of unease. -- Alan Mackenzie (Nuremberg, Germany).