From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Alan Mackenzie Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Proposal for an improved `help-for-help' Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2021 15:02:47 +0000 Message-ID: References: <838s7hxqkr.fsf@gnu.org> <83mtua9isw.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="12758"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Eli Zaretskii , Stefan Kangas , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Dmitry Gutov Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Apr 08 17:03:37 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1lUWC0-00037R-6H for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 08 Apr 2021 17:03:36 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:56386 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lUWBs-0004Th-Oj for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 08 Apr 2021 11:03:28 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:54280) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lUWBK-00043B-KP for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 08 Apr 2021 11:02:54 -0400 Original-Received: from colin.muc.de ([193.149.48.1]:43107 helo=mail.muc.de) by eggs.gnu.org with smtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lUWBH-000679-9I for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 08 Apr 2021 11:02:54 -0400 Original-Received: (qmail 21750 invoked by uid 3782); 8 Apr 2021 15:02:48 -0000 Original-Received: from acm.muc.de (p4fe15b29.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [79.225.91.41]) (using STARTTLS) by colin.muc.de (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Thu, 08 Apr 2021 17:02:47 +0200 Original-Received: (qmail 6734 invoked by uid 1000); 8 Apr 2021 15:02:47 -0000 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Submission-Agent: TMDA/1.3.x (Ph3nix) X-Primary-Address: acm@muc.de Received-SPF: pass client-ip=193.149.48.1; envelope-from=acm@muc.de; helo=mail.muc.de X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:267619 Archived-At: Hello, Dmitry. On Thu, Apr 08, 2021 at 17:50:45 +0300, Dmitry Gutov wrote: > On 08.04.2021 17:08, Alan Mackenzie wrote: > > It feels like > > "international" is being used as a euphemism for "foreign". If we > > really mean "foreign" that is what we should write. > "foreign" implies a specific point of reference. So does "international", used as it is here. > What's foreign to you may not be foreign to me, or some other user. That's precisely my point. Writing "international" when "foreign" is meant, as it seems to be in this context, does not make it better. I think it makes it worse - as well as the "preferred" specific point of reference, we also have the euphemism. My suggested replacement was "non-English", which is precisely what is meant. -- Alan Mackenzie (Nuremberg, Germany).