From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Jean Louis Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Suggested experimental test Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2021 14:21:17 +0300 Message-ID: References: <831ba60af0cbfdd95686@heytings.org> <87mtuxj8ue.fsf@gnus.org> <9088e12cb3169cdcdbc4@heytings.org> <9088e12cb3a70cbf66aa@heytings.org> <9088e12cb381e11e6d32@heytings.org> <9088e12cb36020430ea2@heytings.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="4023"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Mutt/2.0.6 (2021-03-06) Cc: "Alfred M. Szmidt" , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Gregory Heytings Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Mon Mar 22 12:24:48 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1lOIfw-0000t3-8z for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 22 Mar 2021 12:24:48 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:41886 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lOIfv-0006U5-7i for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 22 Mar 2021 07:24:47 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:48934) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lOIec-0005Bv-AM for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 22 Mar 2021 07:23:26 -0400 Original-Received: from stw1.rcdrun.com ([217.170.207.13]:44775) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lOIeY-0004Ms-R3; Mon, 22 Mar 2021 07:23:25 -0400 Original-Received: from localhost ([::ffff:41.202.241.53]) (AUTH: PLAIN securesender, TLS: TLS1.3,256bits,ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) by stw1.rcdrun.com with ESMTPSA id 000000000001E079.0000000060587E25.00004FF1; Mon, 22 Mar 2021 04:23:17 -0700 Mail-Followup-To: Gregory Heytings , "Alfred M. Szmidt" , emacs-devel@gnu.org Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <9088e12cb36020430ea2@heytings.org> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=217.170.207.13; envelope-from=bugs@gnu.support; helo=stw1.rcdrun.com X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:266747 Archived-At: * Gregory Heytings [2021-03-22 02:47]: > What kind of poll would you like to see? What would you consider to be a > significant enough fraction of Emacs users? How would you poll them? There > has been a survey a few months ago, and in spite of the fact that there were > more than 7000 replies, many complained that the results were not > representative. You do not need a poll of many users. But you have to make proper study. Editor and any software and computer usability may be measured with few people only. References: https://www.nngroup.com/articles/why-you-only-need-to-test-with-5-users/ https://www.nngroup.com/videos/usability-testing-w-5-users-design-process/ In my opinion here we talk about usability related to inserting a new line. The fundamental useful command is inserting a new line or `open-line'. What you are here proposing is to replace key binding with something else like C-o C-o -- but you forget the fundamental usefulness of it. How about talking about the fundamental feauture of opening a new line or inserting new empty line and improving that, if at all possible? How do you do? How other users do it? Why would it be more usable for user to press C-o C-o to insert new line rather than C-o ? That is better discussed rather than purpose of removing or replacing key bindings for purpose of some other commands on C-o -- I hope you understand difference between those purposes. Jean