From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Jean Louis Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [External] : Re: Concern about new binding. Date: Fri, 12 Feb 2021 10:59:13 +0300 Message-ID: References: <5588fb25805d486be704@heytings.org> <5588fb2580d7e46863dd@heytings.org> <5588fb2580f248753c30@heytings.org> <5588fb25800032b1a06a@heytings.org> <993b9ce74de32c5450c3@heytings.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="3229"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Mutt/2.0 (3d08634) (2020-11-07) Cc: Gregory Heytings , "emacs-devel@gnu.org" To: Drew Adams Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Fri Feb 12 09:03:28 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1lATQF-0000iS-Fp for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 12 Feb 2021 09:03:27 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:51632 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lATQE-00038J-Gq for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Fri, 12 Feb 2021 03:03:26 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:38066) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lATPa-0002h6-Eg for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 12 Feb 2021 03:02:46 -0500 Original-Received: from stw1.rcdrun.com ([217.170.207.13]:39817) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1lATPW-0003Et-AU for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 12 Feb 2021 03:02:45 -0500 Original-Received: from localhost ([::ffff:41.202.241.3]) (AUTH: PLAIN securesender, TLS: TLS1.2,256bits,ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) by stw1.rcdrun.com with ESMTPSA id 000000000001DFF5.000000006026361E.00003615; Fri, 12 Feb 2021 01:02:38 -0700 Mail-Followup-To: Drew Adams , Gregory Heytings , "emacs-devel@gnu.org" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: Received-SPF: pass client-ip=217.170.207.13; envelope-from=bugs@gnu.support; helo=stw1.rcdrun.com X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:264461 Archived-At: * Drew Adams [2021-02-06 21:10]: > > | (A) | (B) | > > |---------------|---------------| > > | C-x j | C-o j | > > | C-x j = f | C-o j = f | > > | C-x j t . % + | C-o j t . % + | > > | C-x 4 j | C-o 4 j | > > | C-x x : | C-o x : | > > | C-x x t e | C-o x t e | > > | C-x x t + b | C-o x t + b | > > You don't seem to be hearing that I want more > than just reserving one prefix key, `C-o'. I am using zile very often as Zile Is Lossy Emacs. Zile editor has C-o that does same what current Emacs does. It adopted C-o because of Emacs. Changing C-o in Emacs would break all the habits of using C-o in Emacs like editors and Emacs like keybindings in other software. To me that does not make sense. There is `mg' editor that is used in BSD derivates as Emacs replacement and it uses C-o to open-line `qemacs' uses C-o to open-line because it follows Emacs key bindings. `e3em' uses C-o to open-line because it follows Emacs key bindings. Changing C-o would break users' habits, and many other editors rely on some standard Emacs bindings. That introduces much confusion. I realize you did not use C-o often and I am surprised, I have observed few other people here also did not find use of C-o. How do you open move the current line and come into previous line to insert that one? That would involve something like C-a ENTER C-p if cursor is not at beginning of the line. If cursor is at beginning then ENTER C-p. With C-o I do: C-a C-o if cursors is in the middle of the line and C-o if cursor is at begin of the line. And I use C-o so often, many times daily. In vi editos I use "O". Without knowing that some people never use C-o I found it very important command, and while used in other editors I find it surprising that proposals come to remove C-o to something else. Removing C-o is to me same as removing C-x C-f Those empty keys or less known C-x bindings would be just fine. Jean