From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Drew Adams Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: RE: [External] : Re: discoverability, better defaults and which-key in Emacs Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2024 23:47:31 +0000 Message-ID: References: <874jetaxri.fsf@jeremybryant.net> <86fryc1vsh.fsf@gnu.org> <86r0hu4qk8.fsf@gnu.org> <86eddu3pbd.fsf@gnu.org> <87fry7uap7.fsf@jeremybryant.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="21885"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: Eli Zaretskii , Howard Melman , "emacs-devel@gnu.org" To: Jeremy Bryant Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Mon Feb 05 00:48:39 2024 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1rWmE3-0005XR-Iv for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Mon, 05 Feb 2024 00:48:39 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rWmDF-0001F2-O9; Sun, 04 Feb 2024 18:47:49 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rWmDA-0001E2-3Y for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 04 Feb 2024 18:47:45 -0500 Original-Received: from mx0a-00069f02.pphosted.com ([205.220.165.32]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1rWmD6-0005po-DJ; Sun, 04 Feb 2024 18:47:42 -0500 Original-Received: from pps.filterd (m0246627.ppops.net [127.0.0.1]) by mx0b-00069f02.pphosted.com (8.17.1.19/8.17.1.19) with ESMTP id 414KiiEP030788; Sun, 4 Feb 2024 23:47:35 GMT DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=oracle.com; h=from : to : cc : subject : date : message-id : references : in-reply-to : content-type : content-transfer-encoding : mime-version; s=corp-2023-11-20; bh=tx/g36H9zAGJYVHcziw297Ka7THakMiTockFYXWUDTc=; b=AczZZIDbqYNFiwhldO5OZ3aueUaGIlTEd9uDW6wmj4b88Ik4xHc7oSu68x5mrzXuTEr4 +K+Oxt5xsIoqG9xfqW44HiV3MpzrQSg9Z1Xh1xl9cBzYFlnIHb5ml8KOO5ln4oesGmO9 UlDGkcJGSJ6OtsqKcMuN3vvI7QUuuTb+EPxkYsYdnCQAN/xwGLjGvqQDxnWRZcRkoRWs PxQY8SBhXAtgZgnZAdbrOVKdeS2GcSnDhhzWVSjjH570CL4gaRteSRBe+TJzJYaYOBtW JjoF3JunxSaTXEN4SNwdSxT82+rHFV3iQIHdhdAlIT+mWCkbyvYJmohxj0FyOofwf+po Gw== Original-Received: from iadpaimrmta02.imrmtpd1.prodappiadaev1.oraclevcn.com (iadpaimrmta02.appoci.oracle.com [147.154.18.20]) by mx0b-00069f02.pphosted.com (PPS) with ESMTPS id 3w1c32jgku-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 04 Feb 2024 23:47:35 +0000 Original-Received: from pps.filterd (iadpaimrmta02.imrmtpd1.prodappiadaev1.oraclevcn.com [127.0.0.1]) by iadpaimrmta02.imrmtpd1.prodappiadaev1.oraclevcn.com (8.17.1.19/8.17.1.19) with ESMTP id 414LvLYS038399; Sun, 4 Feb 2024 23:47:34 GMT Original-Received: from nam10-mw2-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-mw2nam10lp2100.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.55.100]) by iadpaimrmta02.imrmtpd1.prodappiadaev1.oraclevcn.com (PPS) with ESMTPS id 3w1bx4qt6u-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 04 Feb 2024 23:47:34 +0000 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=mPYL7c8L8cfrWoP6lK/Oa4ef6PxbsN4nQuuXQsZlJCF8fyeFCBxSyp0jvjWhaWEHXYPWTrrSrRcyCPO6RZPI8WMsd47oRfv4A1tlyoSm3wDPp9RpILQkN7rrJGDrvlMYkpekS6RyAhWcETENASRZrIrbYNxfHsKw9JE3U8oBZEudCthuu1kCNnmcU9oc3ifyNTdu5uYAvcmF58afyhoKVsi7Wl8Zj7jd/lwJltWwVR0VulrVu7rplMLV3qGO19FiKB4B+nYFTM9mpvB9jcIZeyQ63mspCzVG/c3FiHVS8ZZBDlyJCXSZSHWoRTWpYieN+fpyfGEJfn0mXWpRqtdDCg== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=microsoft.com; s=arcselector9901; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-ChunkCount:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-0:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-1; bh=tx/g36H9zAGJYVHcziw297Ka7THakMiTockFYXWUDTc=; b=mlZI8wYOaHI0mOtWwpUfZStGtUGnM1ElpYJkOOtdCAXCtCPQ/YkTw0pgoD8S7P6S380tlnGBE/d4htlMNS7ZrsbC1SI+os5YN4L+gYeARV3TMOLH7nHNZPHRfTN+JlWsdqOjFRTBEpApgE4pUnp+bzl0cA/maxHxss9C1tg4HdcRZ4HHVzQPAu+vvxCcWIwS/2pbHKGCO0eXSU9DJV6geOfHeGqgFQgGqxrMk4Ko9Su2q1WkGwRQ3TaM7guBeaBO3NE1KOq2LuIqKfyNNpUn0i9fSGouwH+4xUXVAyci6cWGjjtGCnPcWaAIOGQf7y+U9FvYMHAaFDIWHm0qObHHaQ== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.microsoft.com 1; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=oracle.com; dmarc=pass action=none header.from=oracle.com; dkim=pass header.d=oracle.com; arc=none DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=oracle.onmicrosoft.com; s=selector2-oracle-onmicrosoft-com; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=tx/g36H9zAGJYVHcziw297Ka7THakMiTockFYXWUDTc=; b=Qd7mvo02Qon5aofdChQF/c8leB2ns2wAgGNIUUgr7fLJ1Eo5wNnsCE5fI/l/1EWdkYB/kxTdLuFBDiFtCizGsztLGRGD9gkvgUazcIt/4Y8MU6nJB1d4CAIHRXuMXz6VqzKUYQ+OV4yjQWonwN2t3RV1Xcwrtp8lgPge/1KanJQ= Original-Received: from SJ0PR10MB5488.namprd10.prod.outlook.com (2603:10b6:a03:37e::19) by CO1PR10MB4433.namprd10.prod.outlook.com (2603:10b6:303:6e::16) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.7249.34; Sun, 4 Feb 2024 23:47:32 +0000 Original-Received: from SJ0PR10MB5488.namprd10.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::7eb0:e361:caf4:a410]) by SJ0PR10MB5488.namprd10.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::7eb0:e361:caf4:a410%4]) with mapi id 15.20.7249.027; Sun, 4 Feb 2024 23:47:31 +0000 Thread-Topic: [External] : Re: discoverability, better defaults and which-key in Emacs Thread-Index: AQHaV7llnqF/YhkTl0WBqxlbC3ByQ7D61OkA In-Reply-To: <87fry7uap7.fsf@jeremybryant.net> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: SJ0PR10MB5488:EE_|CO1PR10MB4433:EE_ x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 9ee2133f-b58e-45d4-5d8f-08dc25dba776 x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1 x-ms-exchange-antispam-relay: 0 x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: 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 x-forefront-antispam-report: CIP:255.255.255.255; CTRY:; LANG:en; SCL:1; SRV:; IPV:NLI; SFV:NSPM; H:SJ0PR10MB5488.namprd10.prod.outlook.com; PTR:; CAT:NONE; SFS:(13230031)(376002)(39860400002)(136003)(366004)(346002)(396003)(230922051799003)(451199024)(186009)(64100799003)(1800799012)(26005)(33656002)(55016003)(41300700001)(38070700009)(5660300002)(44832011)(9686003)(86362001)(122000001)(66476007)(66946007)(6916009)(66446008)(64756008)(76116006)(4744005)(54906003)(2906002)(66556008)(7696005)(71200400001)(6506007)(478600001)(316002)(38100700002)(52536014)(8676002)(8936002)(4326008); DIR:OUT; SFP:1101; x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-chunkcount: 1 x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-0: =?us-ascii?Q?X/MhmIhw0PpZREQNRdGWl3+Myc6JyO95H6SvbE3ZLDZGwcYURO7kLcRYk/d8?= =?us-ascii?Q?pHgKcXmVdnjOHEZPUuCv/rbBn7BXpYvleoFU4lv0jAc0lKESBjFr4jeNukBy?= =?us-ascii?Q?oOcH+XvSVxGO5gXcuXMyS3uDx7GvxTtQFzKOvsAHJZNGop49oNzAZSCSw3Fv?= =?us-ascii?Q?DRLs+uyUVikXRy26eUdVXZd7thLfVK3e1i8+lUQM4lnJhs+rnUuh6Hhqo4Nf?= =?us-ascii?Q?JUr3VDXIgiI3ht7/egm57dVVWppjhEcDmVgwPf4SAGlDEFKGk+J4cyRmrlnc?= =?us-ascii?Q?nvR8sGNKayFWPey3heUNnzeHifOu3xo2ZwxVC43dT14nL97+Kz1SRyVQzYvD?= =?us-ascii?Q?yWkn/jcM0GzodbmWYS1WMNNty8N8p35ZdrFquWUfsHo2OL6P8FuBjeP3qe3W?= =?us-ascii?Q?8BCd3bHFkI3hFiJSvjTbnEsWhHM8FK/kuHYcFZToCMOLHwvbEFXRKnUEuqPU?= =?us-ascii?Q?0A6KlaZFZ8Wopsx8gv6znO11g7UenoGdcJf65CPOtDNPaD7GOGxIbWU5hbAL?= =?us-ascii?Q?dTS7sRmMx1jmS8cHxWRak5PL+Ku0s1y2DzWZ2j/eQ4XEAKl3mB/DcAr8mM2I?= =?us-ascii?Q?EFuDZVivabAY+0PRW+FE6zPMo7GbF/+DX3En6UW8eLFhD+JdZccIbAITq06h?= =?us-ascii?Q?me X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-ExternalHop-MessageData-ChunkCount: 1 X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-ExternalHop-MessageData-0: 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 X-OriginatorOrg: oracle.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: SJ0PR10MB5488.namprd10.prod.outlook.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 9ee2133f-b58e-45d4-5d8f-08dc25dba776 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 04 Feb 2024 23:47:31.7089 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 4e2c6054-71cb-48f1-bd6c-3a9705aca71b X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: qqV4gagq/9YY9oWAPf5FvWH3d8zC/qRDK347rAtLM2gTB6M2FI/HEpHf0eH9MxCWGKjk2bvOwmlWL5q+3cxIJw== X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: CO1PR10MB4433 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=baseguard engine=ICAP:2.0.272,Aquarius:18.0.1011,Hydra:6.0.619,FMLib:17.11.176.26 definitions=2024-02-04_14,2024-01-31_01,2023-05-22_02 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 malwarescore=0 spamscore=0 mlxlogscore=755 bulkscore=0 mlxscore=0 phishscore=0 adultscore=0 suspectscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2311290000 definitions=main-2402040183 X-Proofpoint-GUID: Rsbj7IZj_NEqKR3Uc1PqOsycbq2j1_1z X-Proofpoint-ORIG-GUID: Rsbj7IZj_NEqKR3Uc1PqOsycbq2j1_1z Received-SPF: pass client-ip=205.220.165.32; envelope-from=drew.adams@oracle.com; helo=mx0a-00069f02.pphosted.com X-Spam_score_int: -30 X-Spam_score: -3.1 X-Spam_bar: --- X-Spam_report: (-3.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H5=-1, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:315872 Archived-At: > > Not to distract, but FYI library `keysee.el' is > > an alternative to which-key. Less known, some > > differences, maybe worth checking out. >=20 > Interesting > It seems you are author? > Would you suggest this as a candidate for core or ELPA? Doesn't matter to me. Just posted the info as an FYI. Keysee does things differently from which-key, but there are many similarities. Probably no reason to provide both as part of Emacs. But perhaps some of the keysee features are of interest. I think maybe which-key has by now implemented some of them (e.g. on-demand, in addition to automatic? top-level, in addition to post-prefix?), but I'm no expert on this. I mentioned on-the-fly sorting. That, plus ability to also match against command names (or combinations of key and command names) are a couple features that I think which-key might lack.