From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Drew Adams Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: indent-tabs-mode default [was: Representation of the Emacs userbase on emacs-devel] Date: Fri, 3 Sep 2021 17:49:43 +0000 Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="11347"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: "philipk@posteo.net" , "danflscr@gmail.com" , "rms@gnu.org" , "emacs-devel@gnu.org" , "monnier@iro.umontreal.ca" , "john@yates-sheets.org" To: Eli Zaretskii , Dmitry Gutov Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Fri Sep 03 20:13:02 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1mMDgS-0002ef-ON for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; 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envelope-from=drew.adams@oracle.com; helo=mx0a-00069f02.pphosted.com X-Spam_score_int: -27 X-Spam_score: -2.8 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.8 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:273810 Archived-At: I'll just mention this reason that `indent-tabs-mode' should be OFF by default "nowadays". It's a reason that wasn't so strong in past years, I think. With it OFF, code copied from Emacs (vanilla, 3rd-party, or just code someone tossed off in *scratch*) and pasted into online forums (StackExchange, Reddit,... whatever), or emails (not necessarily plain-text), or applications won't have its apparent indentation changed. That's a good thing. I see this gotcha a lot on emacs.StackExchange, for instance. A user copies and pastes some code, and the indentation is broken (but maybe not super noticeably), because TAB chars are used here & there for indentation. That means the user (or someone else) needs to then notice that apparent change (gotcha), and then edit the code to give it reasonable indentation. Even a user (such as myself) who's aware of the gotcha needs to, e.g., use `M-x untabify' before copying, when using `emacs -Q'. Some users don't know `untabify', and they end up doing the TAB-at-a-time editing outside Emacs, in the paste destination. That's a shame. This is a small reason, perhaps. But it is one more. It's an unnecessary bother, IMO. It's easy enough for some local use (e.g. following the standards of some organization) to customize the option to ON. But that should no longer be the default, IMO.