From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Drew Adams Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: RE: [External] : Re: Concern about new binding. Date: Wed, 3 Feb 2021 16:27:23 +0000 Message-ID: References: <20210202134950.vybbpf3iewbymfjo.ref@Ergus> <20210202134950.vybbpf3iewbymfjo@Ergus> <87lfc5s9wg.fsf@gmail.com> <87y2g5xurt.fsf@igel.home> <87tuqtxtpw.fsf@igel.home> <83sg6d42o4.fsf@gnu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="4716"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: "rms@gnu.org" , "rpluim@gmail.com" , "gregory@heytings.org" , "emacs-devel@gnu.org" , "ams@gnu.org" , "schwab@linux-m68k.org" To: Eli Zaretskii , "thibaut.verron@gmail.com" Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Wed Feb 03 17:34:58 2021 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1l7L7K-00014t-KH for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 03 Feb 2021 17:34:58 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:52554 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1l7L7J-00022S-Lx for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Wed, 03 Feb 2021 11:34:57 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:53472) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1l7L07-0002v4-RN for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 03 Feb 2021 11:27:31 -0500 Original-Received: from aserp2130.oracle.com ([141.146.126.79]:46522) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1l7L05-0003Da-LW; Wed, 03 Feb 2021 11:27:31 -0500 Original-Received: from pps.filterd (aserp2130.oracle.com [127.0.0.1]) by aserp2130.oracle.com (8.16.0.42/8.16.0.42) with SMTP id 113GFcCP179004; Wed, 3 Feb 2021 16:27:25 GMT DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=oracle.com; h=from : to : cc : subject : date : message-id : references : in-reply-to : content-type : content-transfer-encoding : mime-version; s=corp-2020-01-29; bh=UMxq4/XlFAQMDMfKWoADTBfPRfldop9jASnfrgEGyn8=; b=Vh26hDO2mb4DNZbu2YieJWxKHQU302wbWc5CgZzmd1PhvjSx/rWgf509MtlQDcIGs00a MPVphiyRKZRH0b0iyYrimTMowtjFROhL7fkw+IIxWocAbLKtKOzFWxjpEOU+PIZa8101 PNAlBFY8LvjMRAIBXnodYC/sr7JucW1Qql+x5E86D0niYcg9vmNr+OkHmv3BukLMM4da FDF0UcsfUjQ6taAKeYnM+kvsOUFDJLIOXsvq0tvwR/YidqAnvLlT9GfDFR/A+1uBY7zW bv2fq2uCZmpuTuKT86fVECxDscxfL73ihzCZ03NrgQR94CyIExMCJbAnKUrl8QTh6ySw zA== Original-Received: from aserp3020.oracle.com (aserp3020.oracle.com [141.146.126.70]) by aserp2130.oracle.com with ESMTP id 36cvyb12kw-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 03 Feb 2021 16:27:25 +0000 Original-Received: from pps.filterd (aserp3020.oracle.com [127.0.0.1]) by aserp3020.oracle.com (8.16.0.42/8.16.0.42) with SMTP id 113GF3IC051814; Wed, 3 Feb 2021 16:27:25 GMT Original-Received: from nam11-dm6-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-dm6nam11lp2175.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.57.175]) by aserp3020.oracle.com with ESMTP id 36dhc1bkyn-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 03 Feb 2021 16:27:25 +0000 ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=SB3HtKcu7YApeIZIu5izeyXUEeNd4g1MD1ApY6H8g0qlw5nnxO5S+Ce7IDHNSOmML7/xdN+0F1x0/0QlzE6dFGiSDOpagJuRLHgC/1v9VJNzHYphRYDXZ/8u1YfcOjCZG3MLfU3LlUK/79XfdjdLfpx8CdZPyxNhHfpDSae3gEpgn1yCa4gJxoGYK6JRos2WVknZ7qaO4BgcHtJIyic1/HzQqwxYoq0GYSE5CGmfWmcP83DulYwod0O8jWjeQVzTA7CeqQtxbM/Q0JefQg3WHPiPoRnsEhLPadiig2EEtite5m570KAjoo0nPUTc6cS5xadhRSKuWZVEq79pglQg1g== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=microsoft.com; s=arcselector9901; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=UMxq4/XlFAQMDMfKWoADTBfPRfldop9jASnfrgEGyn8=; b=ckxpgNKairgv4+4nIWjsfP1RSQKlgshX0CbuilDSeEgFnTPv5WaCXMfpeVTdrSjl1p0DjD7t0KXIDLa2JRECKwh5t8+MCPA6rZHnktc0e8auhbc8waW0Kes6KNyt/hgx5hFIdrJGIuc2OifMuGEXorSgmD/eMXmMs/4KAy7twEfHv3iDuUxIF7tCOZCUgXDwsgrrTSJFNTz2rnYJw9fTzFXxNoyrMa5pjNZaxgvMqJbeDpvq+q+QJQBGnUuqBbxtzkmts1VLQy8htof2XzNe8yurA5xwsbWos5+yI1dEyFedpqddmjfsa/3WBRUO6cSpQwZdukDShCtdZ4HtkOo7jA== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.microsoft.com 1; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=oracle.com; dmarc=pass action=none header.from=oracle.com; dkim=pass header.d=oracle.com; arc=none DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=oracle.onmicrosoft.com; s=selector2-oracle-onmicrosoft-com; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=UMxq4/XlFAQMDMfKWoADTBfPRfldop9jASnfrgEGyn8=; b=uQxDagaoSoSNW0uCwjSQv+Pwc4VVx+wa8P355MfX/ZOTWY4tyUVibqLiEfW7CFui1GA7OZKtOCBUOcnCX01ZqTeV2ROb70FmT/0iiGxJsJRqLNyqlo5ZqlqHQFVaJh6m035aGiiAgFEfRinJL+OptsL1vTjD2r1EtDFFWRFIclg= Original-Received: from SA2PR10MB4474.namprd10.prod.outlook.com (2603:10b6:806:11b::15) by SA2PR10MB4475.namprd10.prod.outlook.com (2603:10b6:806:118::24) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.3805.19; Wed, 3 Feb 2021 16:27:23 +0000 Original-Received: from SA2PR10MB4474.namprd10.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::dc4d:9cd0:2010:daa2]) by SA2PR10MB4474.namprd10.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::dc4d:9cd0:2010:daa2%7]) with mapi id 15.20.3825.020; Wed, 3 Feb 2021 16:27:23 +0000 Thread-Topic: [External] : Re: Concern about new binding. Thread-Index: AQHW+j1EOq8vb8Swe02s3oly9UpLw6pGnWpA In-Reply-To: <83sg6d42o4.fsf@gnu.org> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US authentication-results: gnu.org; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;gnu.org; dmarc=none action=none header.from=oracle.com; x-originating-ip: [73.170.83.28] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 06c64cd4-5347-4545-ee3b-08d8c8609641 x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: SA2PR10MB4475: x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-ms-oob-tlc-oobclassifiers: OLM:8882; x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1 x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: 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 x-forefront-antispam-report: CIP:255.255.255.255; CTRY:; LANG:en; SCL:1; SRV:; IPV:NLI; SFV:NSPM; H:SA2PR10MB4474.namprd10.prod.outlook.com; PTR:; CAT:NONE; SFS:(396003)(39860400002)(346002)(136003)(366004)(376002)(66946007)(86362001)(5660300002)(33656002)(9686003)(316002)(76116006)(66446008)(64756008)(44832011)(66556008)(66476007)(186003)(52536014)(55016002)(8936002)(4326008)(478600001)(6506007)(2906002)(71200400001)(26005)(4744005)(110136005)(7696005)(8676002)(54906003); DIR:OUT; SFP:1101; x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata: =?us-ascii?Q?06pZCqgHWMXygUaVPOvhRnIeuYP9TOspOtNxSslbIYYsWT1bRyH0hmhFM+Zi?= =?us-ascii?Q?A6SPOYSCDjl31VhmjaZrAreHbk/1xjLZJCP19U1xE2jQlgvxAk5Dz3hyIbr2?= =?us-ascii?Q?y7XFAU+gP8bUwFltdXrB6YUDCtKpvYIMX5Nt0XwsqUPDkx0y8NNjDR+/gCDH?= =?us-ascii?Q?8Lu28/rOD8OrnsV2NEQSfuo9qp2cCH9/CcdAzszpk7isqW9+2uTO6fbM3tav?= =?us-ascii?Q?qUWjKtcaIqNQ79iAb/CDMBV8D5lfQLAMkwq1qqgyCUefPrhvIbgx0Mx3TqnM?= =?us-ascii?Q?zXNJaacM+8iJn1oGA5befcH25VAgHD3BL51frX7nAeXupMZmU1ENz9nw79WF?= =?us-ascii?Q?Aqe7WRS5bkP3Uw8SpmbGaPx6IVee1YNobsGxAnlbxIyT8vFqhqTH1da2xv4x?= =?us-ascii?Q?IJkyaA8gBsydywoNuUI7dxgMOhn01HFKfSrqNBSTvx4iLvZjOqWJJpS6nJ3Q?= =?us-ascii?Q?Zck/i7+nVT3WY/OsTCSFFLmZyhEKEOsEdr//DYUlNC9Pj0jLRcVKlOdMVjJe?= =?us-ascii?Q?L77JLUrq4yZZqyn0CbRA+z2ajqWGdRmzr8vDux8NwqW2qaTI/8Q54zftWAOg?= =?us-ascii?Q?92kzVO7IBNpufZdQwQL9DulzJPahLNEsN2msJ6w7cj4eTGlHXI9uomkEze5X?= =?us-ascii?Q?zUNB x-ms-exchange-transport-forked: True X-OriginatorOrg: oracle.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: SA2PR10MB4474.namprd10.prod.outlook.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 06c64cd4-5347-4545-ee3b-08d8c8609641 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 03 Feb 2021 16:27:23.4929 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 4e2c6054-71cb-48f1-bd6c-3a9705aca71b X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: WYJqR7d2iHEsamDqUr/qEdPJlpUYv+UBXpCbVnmWq/mEBGnZdfGQeN12/jY4kFqyakKrDaAFh5HEpDo7O525/A== X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: SA2PR10MB4475 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6200 definitions=9884 signatures=668683 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 bulkscore=0 adultscore=0 suspectscore=0 spamscore=0 mlxscore=0 malwarescore=0 mlxlogscore=687 phishscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2102030099 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=6200 definitions=9884 signatures=668683 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 clxscore=1015 impostorscore=0 mlxscore=0 spamscore=0 bulkscore=0 priorityscore=1501 adultscore=0 lowpriorityscore=0 malwarescore=0 phishscore=0 mlxlogscore=980 suspectscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2102030099 Received-SPF: pass client-ip=141.146.126.79; envelope-from=drew.adams@oracle.com; helo=aserp2130.oracle.com X-Spam_score_int: -43 X-Spam_score: -4.4 X-Spam_bar: ---- X-Spam_report: (-4.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:263807 Archived-At: > > What is still unclear to me is why a *global* binding for > > revert-buffer is useful. >=20 > So that users could remember only a single key sequence, and it would > do the job regardless of the current major mode. That's the reason for _any_ global key. But what's the reason for a global key for `revert-buffer'? Why does Emacs need to sacrifice a key for this by default? What happened to seeing what users actually do? If zillions of users bind a global key for `revert-buffer' - and especially if they're all wanting the same key - then we have a good case to consider. But we don't have that, do we?