From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Ergus via "Emacs development discussions." Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: A proposal for a friendlier Emacs Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2020 09:45:43 +0200 Message-ID: References: <4be18b5f-dc07-2703-a2de-1ed08916ebdf@gmail.com> <3774c435-60d6-a958-77d1-a831599c85c5@gmail.com> <83sgbd1qsz.fsf@gnu.org> Reply-To: Ergus Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="4482"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: K-9 Mail for Android Cc: nicola.manca85@gmail.com, ams@gnu.org, stefankangas@gmail.com, thibaut.verron@gmail.com To: emacs-devel@gnu.org, Eli Zaretskii , Andrea Corallo Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun Sep 20 09:46:39 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1kJu3T-00013R-Qm for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 20 Sep 2020 09:46:39 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:37086 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kJu3S-0002Ym-Su for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 20 Sep 2020 03:46:38 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:40830) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kJu2l-00026u-L8 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 20 Sep 2020 03:45:56 -0400 Original-Received: from sonic311-13.consmr.mail.bf2.yahoo.com ([74.6.131.123]:35936) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kJu2i-0000It-Gq for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 20 Sep 2020 03:45:55 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=aol.com; s=a2048; t=1600587950; bh=GLFhxaLz8gHjLQNku9wsL0lYXeHBeyWj1PQBpc2U7FU=; h=Date:In-Reply-To:References:Subject:To:From:From:Subject; b=Xaskbj/lh1Az1qad4eh8EF+iLNZEZbFVClta8gzpbcZ5ybXt9nhgC1v4k5itbTpK76ElQ4vPqDUtOj2a0lLFgRQG9dZNrAydo0fZCnMkadCQl3D+TCsCeHdqbr/4riIk3tbvtJ0QB0xVVSvQlrqFynEXo+GDkvjfuNDZnmlH31qKyZOLi8WB6OUmrjOZYLotsIGph07rSw0S5lq24Sw6S9qx9Do/d9/LD+YdszrOcnd0Kbz3pKKcXll9OMZq+L9unE14JaDXkkRCeIkOvSVLeJabVWgnQMdUWKMJ6gkn0Wb7QGx7aSZ4c5fmV80bP7pV9kB+fbRziIm44hGXZLMVWA== X-YMail-OSG: ao2RcvoVM1k0qjOlIAzYaiYBiwlDRfvkdNJ1SDmkEnT.v1QKSNsI4na0dC9mEXF Wk6aSLal0.1tQCeRLqB9yTAZC7ZeNcQYj0OoIw6S4oYmawfbgapZbcjwxPA5tEWzgPqulzBfc7Yf KgzSPsGdw6pQxRmJ79ndPyIg9D0G7tdUTqaVju1Syx.h_gmM1mEgY0YjKXyDnYPt8gzsaY1Fw52W opT0GbhgRAzPKKJqgrxyhks4IG3K.s4uU3rYvgGhBXPOGQp9V10CpqHhtPJ5SfxZ4ylWjvRr7HKz oSyK_uZN5NzhpaTNYDyUjoH.cqTgOwoDMnuyQ4owqp32iRkf6_B.mX33eoV9DKIkM15TL5Cpy5fh Mutg15a0PC7BLNYdj2KA3GovGRH8Vzj9JAktricjdHvVViL0ysWIPO8nBLsqARPiYJlaYK2aLF_h wedBfgcC1vqjEO.Fm.klGjziQz3MEa2ADEv9niDYHvixTnc8bNZzv8z8mbFngDzN2YbsX7q7oEvs kKZ4_UOyIY7EztdHszBkuElHd.uup2WMysz86HUw9uFwEgd28.Cyawz1PqU2ZNk5AT43aR7Dc5x5 tZxHXyagr4J2nFPelV8aGAHn1nK_3SmVTE3jH.s7Qs0buMndR19K4xPxjh6sjYeUmkeR7RJDabUK a0po.aBshliEIgldj8hiZyiOB3YcU0L0NR70sNxpO6e0rho6wdl0Yrmx2K.P9GmAdHz6M3VbCYOe __xgj6fr1BTE9_mcYFsjz2uCghQ0sJY7HJm9Yth5MMntQcbD53PwZjUgps4AQ3nP4SV0_MBmgHNw 8yhf7X5qktzccCdQR756HCpwfVzIFh6QMvb4WTlDaM Original-Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic311.consmr.mail.bf2.yahoo.com with HTTP; Sun, 20 Sep 2020 07:45:50 +0000 Original-Received: by smtp408.mail.ir2.yahoo.com (VZM Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID b44e69c0a9d8f22f0ce254541d0ceeb7; Sun, 20 Sep 2020 07:45:47 +0000 (UTC) In-Reply-To: <83sgbd1qsz.fsf@gnu.org> X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.16583 mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.aol Apache-HttpAsyncClient/4.1.4 (Java/11.0.7) Received-SPF: pass client-ip=74.6.131.123; envelope-from=spacibba@aol.com; helo=sonic311-13.consmr.mail.bf2.yahoo.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: First seen = 2020/09/20 03:13:13 X-ACL-Warn: Detected OS = Linux 3.11 and newer [fuzzy] X-Spam_score_int: -10 X-Spam_score: -1.1 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, FREEMAIL_REPLY=1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:256235 Archived-At: On September 19, 2020 9:59:08 PM GMT+02:00, Eli Zaretskii = wrote: >> Cc: Stefan Kangas , nicola=2Emanca85@gmail=2E= com, >> thibaut=2Everron@gmail=2Ecom, emacs-devel@gnu=2Eorg >> Date: Sat, 19 Sep 2020 19:31:59 +0000 >> From: Andrea Corallo via "Emacs development discussions=2E" > >>=20 >> > If users don't read the normal splash screen, there is no reason to >> > expect them to look at another "setup screen"=2E >>=20 >> I suspect they probably don't read it because there is too much >> information already, adding more would just make it worst=2E > >Are you sure you don't say this as someone who've seen that page many >times already? > >That page is made for people who start Emacs for the first time=2E When >they see that page for the first time, why would we assume they don't >carefully read all of it? There have been too many years of licences nobody reads and msoffice usele= ss splash=2E So people now install the programs just pressing next next nex= t accept=2E The problem is that 90% of the cases the information there is pretty usele= ss (publicity, license, offers for an account) so most people assume that i= n our case it will be the same and usually ignores that=2E --=20 Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail=2E Please excuse my brevity=2E