From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Drew Adams" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: RE: make-variable-buffer-local change Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 13:10:51 -0700 Message-ID: References: <200909251609.n8PG97YN020225@godzilla.ics.uci.edu> <6A896C20C65941FE96D239B7E5A1C667@us.oracle.com> <83fxaau9hd.fsf@gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1253911559 5700 80.91.229.12 (25 Sep 2009 20:45:59 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 20:45:59 +0000 (UTC) Cc: lekktu@gmail.com, dann@ics.uci.edu, lennart.borgman@gmail.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: "'Eli Zaretskii'" Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Sep 25 22:45:52 2009 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1MrHfr-0008Hy-6Z for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 25 Sep 2009 22:45:51 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:50192 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1MrHfq-0005wL-Nu for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 25 Sep 2009 16:45:50 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1MrH8N-0000yv-J4 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 25 Sep 2009 16:11:15 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1MrH8I-0000tZ-BL for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 25 Sep 2009 16:11:14 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=40983 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1MrH8H-0000tE-Tt for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 25 Sep 2009 16:11:10 -0400 Original-Received: from acsinet12.oracle.com ([141.146.126.234]:46540) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1MrH86-0000LJ-UP; Fri, 25 Sep 2009 16:10:59 -0400 Original-Received: from rgminet13.oracle.com (rcsinet13.oracle.com [148.87.113.125]) by acsinet12.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id n8PKA5e9031000 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Fri, 25 Sep 2009 20:10:06 GMT Original-Received: from abhmt005.oracle.com (abhmt005.oracle.com [141.146.116.14]) by rgminet13.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id n8PKBJvE011274; Fri, 25 Sep 2009 20:11:20 GMT Original-Received: from dradamslap1 (/141.144.66.80) by default (Oracle Beehive Gateway v4.0) with ESMTP ; Fri, 25 Sep 2009 13:10:51 -0700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 In-Reply-To: <83fxaau9hd.fsf@gnu.org> Thread-Index: Aco+E9ycIjkf4Q/7Q4abB2ORZNoknwABfspA X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 X-Source-IP: abhmt005.oracle.com [141.146.116.14] X-Auth-Type: Internal IP X-CT-RefId: str=0001.0A090204.4ABD23CC.0168:SCFSTAT5015188,ss=1,fgs=0 X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 1) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:115632 Archived-At: > > > I'd say "use" covers both kinds of use, but I'll defer to natives. > > > > It's not a question of native speakers. "Use" here refers > > to what the string is _for_; what it is used for. > > Would replacing "use" with "set" solve this problem? You missed the point. We don't want to talk about places where the value is set. What's important is what the variable is for. We can give an example of where it is used, if we like, but not where it is set (pretty much irrelevant). It so happens that the place of consumption (buffer-listing code) can be far from the place it is set (e.g. Dired). What is important is to let users know that they can set it for use by buffer-listing code. > > > > Please correct the doc string accordingly. > > > > > > Don't hesitate to send a patch and I'll commit it ASAP. > > > > Just get rid of "Dired, shell and other modes use this variable." > > Sorry, I happen to disagree. This is important information for such > an obscure feature. The alternative is let the user grep the whole > lot of Lisp sources. You missed the point. What's most important about this variable is what it is for, not where in the existing code it happens to be set. _Why_ it is set is important. Which is to say _what it does_ is important - what you can use it for. What this variable does is provide text to use for non-file buffers, when buffers are listed along with their associated file names. It is the consumer of this feature, buffer-listing code, that needs the feature. It is for that use that code (anywhere) sets the variable. It's not for Dired or shell that Dired and shell set this variable - it's for buffer-listing purposes by Buffer Menu and the `Buffers' menus. As I mentioned to Juanma off list, we could add something about the use of the variable, if that helps to clarify things. But what we add shouldn't be about which code happens to set the variable, but rather which code lists buffers and thus makes use of the variable. I suggested adding something like this, if people think something additional is needed: "For example, in the Buffer Menu (`C-x C-b'), if the local value for a given non-file buffer is non-nil, then it is shown in the `File' column for that buffer." (Perhaps "it" should be replaced with "that value", to be clearer.) That describes (gives an example of) what this variable does and how to use it: set its local value for code that lists buffers and their "files" (descriptions).