* Page order in describe-bindings
@ 2024-03-03 4:08 T.V Raman
2024-03-03 7:26 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-03-04 3:45 ` Richard Stallman
0 siblings, 2 replies; 6+ messages in thread
From: T.V Raman @ 2024-03-03 4:08 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: emacs-devel
At present, C-h b (describe-bindings)
shows all the minor mode bindings first, and places the major mode
bindings at the end.
So for instance, when called in a help-mode buffer, the help-mode
bindings are 3400 lines down.
Could we (should we) display major-mode bindings first?
--
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread
* Re: Page order in describe-bindings
2024-03-03 4:08 Page order in describe-bindings T.V Raman
@ 2024-03-03 7:26 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-03-03 14:47 ` T.V Raman
2024-03-04 3:45 ` Richard Stallman
1 sibling, 1 reply; 6+ messages in thread
From: Eli Zaretskii @ 2024-03-03 7:26 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: T.V Raman; +Cc: emacs-devel
> From: "T.V Raman" <raman@google.com>
> Date: Sat, 02 Mar 2024 20:08:21 -0800
>
> At present, C-h b (describe-bindings)
> shows all the minor mode bindings first, and places the major mode
> bindings at the end.
>
> So for instance, when called in a help-mode buffer, the help-mode
> bindings are 3400 lines down.
>
> Could we (should we) display major-mode bindings first?
I don't think this is a good idea, since someone will come later
complaining that they want the minor mode first...
The *Help* buffer generated by "C-h b" has the outline-minor-mode
turned on, so navigation is easy (e.g., "C-c @ C-n" and "C-c @ C-p" to
move between sections). And maybe you want to customize
describe-bindings-outline-rules to the nil value, which will make the
sections hidden, with only the section headings visible: then you can
easily unhide only the section you are interested in. I think
outline-minor-mode all but eliminates the need to decide which part is
first and which follows it.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread
* Re: Page order in describe-bindings
2024-03-03 7:26 ` Eli Zaretskii
@ 2024-03-03 14:47 ` T.V Raman
0 siblings, 0 replies; 6+ messages in thread
From: T.V Raman @ 2024-03-03 14:47 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: eliz; +Cc: raman, emacs-devel
thanks, didn't know about the outline-rules custom option
--
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread
* Re: Page order in describe-bindings
2024-03-03 4:08 Page order in describe-bindings T.V Raman
2024-03-03 7:26 ` Eli Zaretskii
@ 2024-03-04 3:45 ` Richard Stallman
2024-03-04 12:07 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-03-04 15:09 ` T.V Raman
1 sibling, 2 replies; 6+ messages in thread
From: Richard Stallman @ 2024-03-04 3:45 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: T.V Raman; +Cc: emacs-devel
[[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]]
[[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]]
[[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]]
> Could we (should we) display major-mode bindings first?
We certainly could.
Here is why I decided to show the minor modes first.
(1) minor mode bindings override major mode bindings.
(2) minor modes typically did not make many bindinms/
Given those facts, the ordering of minor first
was natural and convenient.
Perhaps nowadays the facts are different; perhaps the major-first
order would be good. But don't be quick to assume that is generally
true.
I have a hunch that the diversity of binding situations is much more now
and that developing a good way to show them all might require more thought.
--
Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org)
Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org)
Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org)
Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org)
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread
* Re: Page order in describe-bindings
2024-03-04 3:45 ` Richard Stallman
@ 2024-03-04 12:07 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-03-04 15:09 ` T.V Raman
1 sibling, 0 replies; 6+ messages in thread
From: Eli Zaretskii @ 2024-03-04 12:07 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: rms; +Cc: raman, emacs-devel
> From: Richard Stallman <rms@gnu.org>
> Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org
> Date: Sun, 03 Mar 2024 22:45:31 -0500
>
> I have a hunch that the diversity of binding situations is much more now
> and that developing a good way to show them all might require more thought.
We now display the *Help* buffer with bindings in outline-minor-mode,
which makes navigation between sections much easier. In addition,
users can customize an option to start the *Help* buffer in "folded"
mode, where only the section heading lines are shown, in which case
the major-mode section is just one or 2 lines away.
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread
* Re: Page order in describe-bindings
2024-03-04 3:45 ` Richard Stallman
2024-03-04 12:07 ` Eli Zaretskii
@ 2024-03-04 15:09 ` T.V Raman
1 sibling, 0 replies; 6+ messages in thread
From: T.V Raman @ 2024-03-04 15:09 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: rms; +Cc: raman, emacs-devel
Makes sense. I also suspect that we now have a far larger number of
minor modes than in the day. One possibility -- in addition to Eli's
suggestion to start with the buffered folded via outlines is to
perhaps have a customization option that simply reverses the order on
user choice.
Richard Stallman writes:
> [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]]
> [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]]
> [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]]
>
> > Could we (should we) display major-mode bindings first?
>
> We certainly could.
>
> Here is why I decided to show the minor modes first.
> (1) minor mode bindings override major mode bindings.
> (2) minor modes typically did not make many bindinms/
> Given those facts, the ordering of minor first
> was natural and convenient.
>
> Perhaps nowadays the facts are different; perhaps the major-first
> order would be good. But don't be quick to assume that is generally
> true.
>
> I have a hunch that the diversity of binding situations is much more now
> and that developing a good way to show them all might require more thought.
>
> --
> Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org)
> Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org)
> Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org)
> Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org)
>
--
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread
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2024-03-03 4:08 Page order in describe-bindings T.V Raman
2024-03-03 7:26 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-03-03 14:47 ` T.V Raman
2024-03-04 3:45 ` Richard Stallman
2024-03-04 12:07 ` Eli Zaretskii
2024-03-04 15:09 ` T.V Raman
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